I try to keep an open mind when it comes to the political climate of the USA and the rest of the world to some degree as well, but the intense hatred spewed towards Musk is something that I am really having a difficult time understanding.
The way that people are going out of their way to attack dealerships and even the individual people who just happen to own the cars is something that kind of blows my mind... and in a very bad way.
Now I am not saying that boycotting a product whose leadership disagrees with you is something that people shouldn't do, I did it once and still stick to it to this day in relation to Coca-Cola, but it never really occurred to me that the "next phase" of my vengeance on this product would be to destroy vending machines or to attack anyone I see that is drinking a Coke.
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The attorney general has called these actions "nothing short of domestic terrorism" and I have to say that I agree with her. It's kind of the very definition of terrorism, isn't it? I mean, if you own a Tesla now you are worried all the time about if something is going to happen to it regardless of what your political views are.
Even though in my mind this is terrorism and the people who engage in this violent protest should be charged as such, the administration is kind of in a situation where they cannot declare it as such because it would be seen as favoritism towards Elon if they were to do so. In my mind I can't think of any other time that a specific business was targeted in this way outside of Trump hotels.
I know that it gets used a lot, but TDS has spurned a special kind of crazy reaction out of people on the left, because has there ever been a time that conservatives did something similar? This is a genuine question too, I would love to know if there was a time that conservatives did something like this on a national or even international scale. I suppose you could say abortion clinics, that's the only thing that I can come up with but the violent situations that comes out of that were extremely rare. According to the wiki there have been been 42 bombings, 200 arson events, and 531 assaults against the patients (a word they spell incorrectly on the wiki) and providers since the 1970's. So I guess that is the same thing in reverse and that is definitely a blemish on conservatives.
I feel as though there is a very real difference between the two though, because abortion has been a contentious topic on political and especially religious grounds since the procedure was made available . The attacks on Tesla and Tesla car owners is rooted in hatred towards one individual: Elon Musk.
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I get that people on the left are going to dislike this guy simply because of his support for DJT, but I am genuinely curious as to how anyone out there can justify what is happening with these actions.
I hope that if you do believe that this is just and deserved that you are able to present the case in a calm and rational manner at the same time.
I think that some of it comes from him being a part (in charge of?) DOGE, which in my mind is a very good and very necessary thing. I own a business that needs to at least break even to stay in business and if you look at the United States government as a business, and you should, it is one of the least functional businesses in the world from a income/expenditures standpoint. Trimming the fat is something that has been necessary for decades but we just never bothered to do so in my lifetime.
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This trend began just before I was born and has just gotten worse and worse as the years went by, no matter who was in power at the time. While I don't know exactly why this is I suspect it has to do with politicians wanting to be re-elected and a great way to make that happen is to promise people "free stuff" since they can't legally offer them money directly for their vote.
When I see that more Teslas are being burned and individuals who own a Tesla are scared of what is going to happen to them and their vehicle, this makes me sad and also makes me very happy that I live in a state with Castle doctrine that allows me to use lethal force to protect myself and my property. As far as I know this sort of crime towards an individual has not happened in North Carolina and I believe this is one of the major reasons why that is the case.
I was never tempted to buy a Tesla or any EV vehicle. This is because they are not conducive to the sort of work that my business does. It simply wouldn't work. Also they don't make them in beat-up, redneck pickup style. I'm no Elon super-fan, I'm rather indifferent towards him but at the same time I am also on his team because this gutting of the waste in government needs to be addressed.
I'm just not understanding how people can be getting so worked up about this guy to the point where they seem to want to destroy anything that he does or any product that his company creates. Remember, if this is some sort of reaction to scare the public into changing their behavior, that is, in fact, terrorism. I would applaud some very stiff sentences to the people that are doing these things but since most of this is happening in places where they are "on the side" of the people that are doing the burning, it is very unlikely to occur.
So please, if you are one of the people that applauds this destruction and mayhem, I would really like it if you could give me a calm and sane explanation as to why you feel this is all justified.
I think the contention with DOGE, which is even stronger from some traditional conservatives like Jonah Goldberg, than from liberals, is not that trimming the fat and auditing the government isn't a good thing, but that Elon's approach is half-baked and seems to be more akin to "break it and then figure it out" rather than coming in with a plan and systematically working through everything. Of course he's doing it this way because it worked at Twitter (or seems to have; the jury is still out on that one), but it shouldn't need said that the government isn't a private business and shouldn't be treated as one. I know many MAGAs preach that that is exactly what the gov needs, and it is fueling some arguments that a authoritarian is a good thing to do exactly what we need done.
Anyway, as to the riots or domestic terrorism or violent protests—whatever we want to call it—I think a lot of it goes back to a sense of powerlessness. All violent protests eventually lead back to this. JFK once made a great quote: "If you make peaceful evolution impossible, you make revolution inevitable." Historically, when a government doesn't listen to the people and makes them feel like they have no say in anything, well... violence results. Certainly I don't condone this Tesla thing. It's terrible. But I feel like I can kind of understand what is fueling it.
thanks for answering in a calm, intelligent, and concise manner. I love it when that can happen.
If you have an opinion on this I would like to know if you think there is an alternative way that they could trim the fat then? Because when I see such opposition to this I can't help but feel as though it is being opposed simply because the "other side" is going to be opposed to anything that the people on the right want to do just out of principal. I believe that some things could end up getting cut by accident during the purge, but in the meantime a lot of genuine waste will also get cut and that is very necessary.
Unfortunately, I feel even moreso that the cuts will be made to look detrimental by the left or even encouraged/ made to be disastrous even when it isn't just to score some political points, even if that means that people get hurt / die as a consequence.
The system as it exists now is very very broken and I'm of the viewpoint that some sort of radical change is very necessary. It's like something that Ron Paul said once about taxation and I'm paraphrasing here when he said "I don't mean that we need to fiddle with tax code a bit like we've done for 100 years, we need to throw it all out and start over."
I mentioned Jonah Goldberg previously. He is not only a very traditional conservative, he was at one time considered pretty far to the right of that, much more than more moderates like Mitt Romney. But now that the MAGAs have taken over the party, he is considered a RINO, as, increasingly are all of the steadfast conservatives. That also calls to mind Barry Goldwater, Mr Conservative himself, who was considered extreme even within the GOP for years, but by the time he retired he jokes to Pat Buchanan that he was now considered a liberal by many of the younger people who were pushing the party further to the right.
That's just to say that it's not just the left that is critical of Trump and Elon. Unless all the conservatives who remain very critical of him are now considered "left". The Democratic Party hasn't had a conservative wing in 50 years or more, it would be a strange thing if all the refugees from the GOP were to join them now. But I suppose strange days create strange and unexpected coalitions.
But we have at least two groups against what Trump is doing: classic Buckley conservatives and progressives. As time goes on, there might be other groups too. Some libertarians are also getting restless. Nick Gillespie, for example, has been relatively outspoken against Trump and Elon.
I don't really know how we can fix things. I mean, if I did I feel like I'd be making a lot more money than I am. But I do think there is some middle ground here between break it all and start over and between do nothing but pretend you did (or, give more tax cuts to the rich while pretending to fix everything).
I mean just for one example: the mass emails offering people a payout to quit. The government tried that in the 90s. The result is the best people quit (because they can easily get much better paying jobs in the private sector) and the worst stay, which is exactly the opposite of what you want. Well unless your goal is to demonize government and you actually want the talent level of employees to go down. That conspiracy theory aside, Elon is using an approach that has already been proven not to work. I think there has to be a much better way to get rid of redundant employees than use a method that will likely result in the best employees quitting. That does nothing to fix the problem, it just goes under the assumption that fewer is better, which isn't necessarily true.
Yes why people turn to violence boggles my mid because as soo as you do that you lose any argument. I have noticed the left is very weak emotionally to the point of being unstable mentally.
It's difficult to not have that sort of opinion these days. I saw a poll conducted by two liberal news outlets that showed that most people in the United States, including those on the left, feel as though the Democrat party is doing a bad job right now. I think it was something really low like around 20% that felt they are going in the correct direction.
I don't support violence against individuals, except Nazis. Kick Nazis in the nuts at every opportunity. That type of ideology can only lead to nasty shit. Individual owners of Tesla products aren't necessarily Nazis, and I don't think vandalizing someone's car is productive. The actions against dealerships are a little different IMO. If it is owned by Tesla/Elon, he who fucketh around, is finding out.
Elon is a Nazi. No, I'm not being hyperbolic, he's a fucking Nazi. Read into his childhood, his labor rights record, and his more recent political appearances in Germany.
He claims his child is DEAD because he refuses to acknowledge who she is as a human being. Just as a parent, fuck that dude.
His DOGE targets are all directly related to regulations and investigations into his companies.
I can keep going, but TL:DR bad people deserve bad things, and this guy hasn't ever faced consequences for anything in his life. He's destroying things that help disadvantaged people because he has no empathy for the people harmed. He's everything wrong with capitalism, rolled into one tiny, insecure man with authoritarian ambitions.
Entirely separate point, government should NOT run like a business. Government is not there to make a profit, it's there to protect civilians from large companies and foreign entities.
Government controls the money supply. Part of it's function has been stripped over the last 60 years, and that is to prevent hoarding of wealth at the top. The highest marginal tax rate was 90% over about $3 million in today's money.
Tax avoidance by people like Elon is why "income" is a problem for the US government. And we spend way too much money on providing bombs to kill people in other nations. Elon going after food assistance rather than the military budget is more proof of his insincerity about saving money.