Had a recent conversation with an onboarded user who was unstaking and converting his HP to HBD instead to stake it for the APR. Now I'm not really judging and the user was very active in sharing their content outside of Hive which is always great to see and worthy of rewards in my opinion, so no harm there. They even mentioned that they've researched hive but the HBD apr was the main thing that "made sense" to them and it just made me wonder if they've researched it enough and if they really "get it".
Now, I know what some of you may be thinking, here's a list of things that some people may say as to why they don't wanna invest in Hive now or potentially for a while.
- inflation is too high
- a lot of rewards go to people who just sell
- still a lot of blind curation overrewarding posts
- some people receiving too much hive for too little effort
- other coins are more primed to do well due to their positions, what they do and their tokenomics being deflationary, etc
and probably a lot more reasons I can't come up with now on the fly.
Here's some things to think about however.
We're closing in on 10 years of its existence.
It's been one of the only coins where the hardfork did better than the original after fighting off a billionaire trying to make a quick buck and attempting to buy off the community.
We have a mostly working inflation that gives us a ton of utility to work together on similar goals for the benefit of the main token.
We can fight off abuse, overrewarding, tricksters, etc with the use of downvotes, witness unvotes, proposal unvotes, undelegations, etc.
Immutable blockchain that stores data such as posts & comments, votes, follows, mutes, community subscriptions, key changes, etc. This helps prevent a ton of shady activities.
No fees and costless RC delegations that allow you to transact to your heart's content.
Most account creations don't cost anything during "still water" periods.
We have one of the longest lasting inflation models that gives everyone enough time to earn the main token which helps decentralization and distribution.
Most of inflation still goes towards authors and curators.
We're starting to enter a declining inflation this year where every year from here on out less and less hive will be created (conversions willing).
We've had a low to moderate price for most of the time the coin has existed, if you'd count the average days and what the price has been I'm fairly sure our median is similar at an all time low as the price is currently - this gives as many as possible the option to get in cheap which many other coins do not anymore.
Our main token gives you attention.
Our main token allows you to direct attention to things you're interested in, to create content, initiatives, drive more attention to things you're building and want more interest to be placed on.
It allows for every stakeholder to welcome new users and make sure they're treated well to grow the network.
Let's compare it this to some other coins out there.
Bitcoin - "ugh price dropped since I bought in, better buy some more to lower the entry price", "I'm now $1000 in profit cause people are buying bitcoin, I could sell now or wait for more profit", "I'm mining bitcoin after having invested in this computer I can't use for anything else than to warm the chair it's under, I'm gonna mine until I get my investment back and then generate some profits unless electricity bill gets too high compared to mining difficulty.", "I'm using all this electricity to solve useless math problems that provide nothing to anyone but keep the network secure" and "I've bought so much Bitcoin and haven't bothered getting interested in anything else - I better make sure to shill bitcoin on web2 social and call everything else a scam because I want all the fiat to flow into my investment only."
Ethereum - pretty much the same except you can also stake eth now and get some apr similar to everyone else.
Now don't get me wrong, I'm not going full KE on people and trying to judge them based on their current holdings and whatnot. I'm just curious if you understand Hive enough and if you're still not bullish based on not just the tokenomics but the utility and everything else it's going going for it.
Are you bullish enough? Why or why not?
Only if we measure it. If we don't measure it, it isn't worth anything. I've started a big ol' investigation into comments on chain, and already I've discovered some interesting things, but I still need to do more research, as I understand there's a lot of layers I haven't yet peeled pack.
As to whether we're too bullish. We're a society on HIVE, aren't we? Are we bullish on society and human interaction is probably the better question - because isn't that what HIVE is meant to be all about?
What do you mean measure what? It's proven that it is immutable, no one can change that and if any witness attempted they'd be voted out.
That there's a lot of automated comments? Yeah that's not really news to anyone, similar to these dumbass automated votes on your comments people like to automate stuff and even manually leave automated looking comment commands like !fart and !lolz as if they're doing god's work distributing donations to the needy.
I've asked front-ends for a long time to generate a "bot list" where we'd place known bot commands in a list so they'd always be under the comment section of regular users or just downvote them to 0 so they'd still be there but hidden under the real ones.
By measure it, I mean we need to identify the bot lists you speak of. If we can't quantify it quickly and clearly, then it can't be controlled. Just like when Musk tried to buy twitter and complained about bots on the platform misrepresenting the true number of users. (And the irony that now its entire contents are used to train grok)
I've started doing an investigation into comments on the chain, I'm not discovering anything I didn't really /know/ about bot accounts but I at least I am getting a list :D - I also found a curious sub set of users who seem to get 200+ upvotes on their comments, which seems to be linked to the front end they're using. Not sure if its a curation trail or abuse, tbh
I'd love your thoughts on what you'd like to see in future analytics on comments, this is a start that I've made: https://peakd.com/hive-133987/@holoz0r/further-analytics-regarding-comments-on-hive
wtf, sounds like the latter.
will try check it out here in a bit, thanks.
Feel free to hit me up on discord or in the comments if you want additional info on what I found, but I will be publishing more as my investigation goes deeper :D
Noticed teamukraine abusing comment self-votes now after I asked them a few weeks ago why the posts of certain authors they voted on seemed to be alt accounts or ai generated... some of the abuse never stops here
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He had skeletons in his closet.
Credit: marshmellowman
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I’ve never been so bullish… the truth is that people will get it eventually. But it’s going to take some time.
You can’t really ignore utility, and as long as we focus on that, we will outlast all the noise out there.
The matter of liquid Hive and HBD, that which is better always come up from different people, but most of the time from people who are still new in the platform or Blockchain in general. People Focuses on main profits and not the process or making impact...
It took me time to analyze something about liquid Hive and HBD. You stake 500 HBD to generate APR, note that the people will be receiving about 6.25 HBD interest monthly...
However, if I should convert 500 HBD to liquid hive and stake as HP with the current price of Hive, it should be giving about 1,850 HP, Which is about 0.016 - 0.020 per curation rewards, when you are able to upvote about 25 - 30 quality post daily, you will be generating about 15-18 HP monthly and in a year it will be 185 - 215 HP interest.
Now, my point here is that liquid Hive has the Greater tendency to increase in the price market and at the point where the price goes up you might be making more profits 2× than the person who stake HBD...
However, there are different people in the space with different motive, goal and dreams.. Meanwhile, for some who still hive it difficult to understand Advantage of HP will definitely do, it just a matter of time..
Yeah I think the HBD apr and hive power apr are at a "good enough" comparison atm, you can get a good return on both but which one you wanna use depends on you.
It's unfortunate that a lot of things here require quite some research and understanding to finally "get it", but the things one can do with HP compared to HBD are insanely more valuable in my eyes.
Exactly 💯...
The only way you can generate income with HBD is by Staking it to get HBD APR. Stake is HBD is just like putting your money in fixed bank account to generate interested...
But talking about HP, it's just like when you are using your money to invest order than keep it stagnant, we have a lot of things one can do with HP that you may not think of doing that with HBD..
Therefore, I will say that HP is my flexible than HBD...
Thank you!!!
I don’t get the trashing Bitcoin part of message. Seems counter productive. Totally different use case. Trashing bitcoin seems silly when it’s the foundation of this whole world. Otherwise I’m with ya! 💯 !PIZZA
The foundation is the technology that makes bitcoin possible, not necessarily how the mining works. There's coins out there where instead of just solving random puzzles such as bitcoin (not even puzzles really just spraying bullets in an ever increasing lake until someone hits the one fish that exists there every 10 minutes), they attempt to find larger prime numbers or other things that may pose some sort of value for all the work.
This technology is what lead to many creating alt coins using it and most if not all of them being secure enough to last over a decade with no one able to hack it.
My issue is that all this power that goes towards "securing" the bitcoin network and all these specific miners that are created that can literally only be used to mine bitcoin could've been better thought out.
Hive for instance does not spend this energy on solving blocks, witnesses get an order instead to solve blocks quickly and easily and relies mostly on 17/20 witnesses not colluding on changing the code foe worse or where they can null or steal other accounts' hive. Thus we are way more efficient and fast and feeless and rely on trust of the voted in witnesses rather than whoever owns most of miners or leads them through mining pools.
I'm not even going to get into how Satoshi intended for bitcoin to be used or how he wanted everyone to be able to mine it. I reckon he left too early to speak on the evolution of mining hardware.
I respect bitcoin for being the first and deflationary but let's not kid ourselves, it's very outdated and not super well thought out, imo.
Very bullish yes, although I’ve started to accumulate “some” HBD. I like both, but if I had to choose only one, it would be the Hive token. I do like HBD more than Canadian dollars in my bank account.
The fact that it’s basically the only blockchain where you can build your own stake without outside fiat investments is a very big thing too.
Permabullish here.
It's ridiculous how people ignore this and keep pointing towards "centralisation" just because some stakeholders vote trade or some witnesses trade votes. I'm just gonna start completely ignoring those negative nancies from now on.
It's also one of the few that allow you to build your whole persona and potential projects fully anonymous. You can earn, swap through dex's/swaps and stay anonymous forever if you like and keep earning that way based on what you do and say and not based on who you are or where from.
Hive should be at least 10$
First: I love HIVE, I know its utility, I know its power, I love its governance structure and I love that anyone an start without fiat to get into it.
But am I bullish on HIVE? That's a lot harder question. What I see is that it isn't on any major exchanges. At least none that I've seen here in Canada. That means less exposure.
But my major issue is documentation. I know that it is possible to do NFT's on HIVE but... how on earth to do it? I know that you can create your own coin...and I have. But figuring out the staking rewards and such is a huge pain. I have great ideas on dApp's I'd love to see and know that HIVE could totally be an awesome platform for them.....but finding a dev to make it? Where do you go for that as a startup?
So...I"m cautiously optimistic about HIVE. If the right app or person comes along and makes a killer app that brings in a steady stream or real world FIAT into the system I'll be way more bullish. But will that happen? No idea.
A comparison of the coins that is definitely worth to think about.
If I am bullish doesn't count within my considerations and doings. I am not here or make a pause because of a bull or a bear. I am here because I am a Hivian and like to support the general idea behind our chain and because I saw and see what Hive can do IRL. Should it be rice on the table, water in wells, breaking free from payroll-slavery aor much more...
And because of this "join the revolution" (wasn't that our slogan?) I am here. In bullish or in bearish times. But it is our responsibility to feed and attract the bull!
Hive ecosystem is very lively - many new things appear, some old apps (Peakd and Ecency) are actively developed. I especially appreciated that after I researched many other blockchains - most of them were empty shells. While Hive's social media is the best in the crypto sphere.
A bad bull season for Hive isn’t about Hive itself: most tokens, including the most promoted ones, haven’t reached a new ATH this cycle either, yet.
I also believe we are entering a time when non-corporate decentralized blockchains like Hive will come into the spotlight.
Coming to a final conclude of a fricking 2 weeks of work, troubleshooting a problem at work, not having enought f time to deal with ANYthing (but just "almost robotic" playing with games you don't even have to think, just to release that pressure of the day) updates on Discord, Hive, etc... feeling that pressure of "you are disapointing everyone, not just at IRLW" and then coming into chain, looking for desperate, "I need to catch up and I know this will be the most reliable same I need"... and checking out a few posts and still feels like, "yep, this is still the place"...
Man... Feels bonkers good.
And even if it has been up and down... people who are valuable and keep going forward, will be understood, recognised and appreciated.
I'm very bullish and waiting for the day for that to really pay off. I have built almost all my stake by being active on Hive for 7 some years. I'm finally hitting the point where I seem to be growing exponentially by just existing and engaging on chain. I'm just waiting for the day the rest of the world finally sees what is being done here and things really explode.
Hive is an excellent platform that provides highly relevant sovereignty to everyone within it. It's much more than a cryptocurrency; it's a space where people can create and connect far beyond technology something we often fail to appreciate enough. Digressing slightly, blockchain messaging should focus precisely on these strengths for the average user rather than overemphasizing technical functionality.
I used Deepseek to translate my comment because english is not my native lang : )
I am pretty much doing both. Staking HBD, earning rewards and slowly growing that amount. Based on my time it's my number 1# choice. At the same by posting and somewhat curating, i increase the staked HP. When i get some liquid Hive, most of the time it is reinvested in other tokens around the Hive ecosystem. I am here since the hardfork and back in the steem days as well. Since i got here i have never had to power down my HP or HBD! I think there is a synergy in there and also one of the great things about Hive is that everyone based on their time, needs, life, goals can earn the way he/she want to earn!
I somewhat agree with @mein-senf-dazu in some aspects, though. A simple example is the Proposals. We are taking about a lot of money wasted just because without anyone actually having consequences.
Most of the "major" attempts that happened to bring people and such ended in failures. Some small groups are doing a decent work but i think and it could be wrong i don't know, that we somehow need to attract "builders" that will understand the benefits of Hive, build their Dapps that will bring more and more people.
As you mentioned we have been 10 years now with a proven track record that this works and still, mostly nobody knows us or even cares. Btc is breaking one ATH after the other while we aren't even close to an ATH. I don't plan on powering down or something anytime soon, i still wish like most of us to see Hive reaching the place that it deserves to be!
Soon the public will begin to appreciate the utility of the blockchain and not just the novelty and potential of cryptocurrency. If I were to guess on a timeline I'd say 3-5 years, as AI is really being integrated into people's daily lives. Those of us who've been in this space for almost a decade easily forget how young this technology really is. When this awakening happens platforms like Hive will be well positioned to be the beneficiaries of that widespread attention.
Well people buy and like btc because it's btc, no other real reason on utility, it's like an average person buying a phone, they gonna buy a mainstream firm like Apple and Samsung even if there is better around... Hive is not mainstream... As for hbd, it depends on everyone mindset, I don't like risks, I like safe shores like stables so I always keep 50-50% from rewards as hive and hbd
More advantages of bitcoin to be found here (I suggest to translate that into English with DeepSeek).
HIVE is fun (sometimes more, sometimes less - less for example when looking at the well-known vote-circles around galenkp or oflyhigh or when looking at the many newbie accounts which are leaving HIVE after a few weeks or months again because the established users are too busy with upvoting each other instead of reading anything else). Bitcoin is real investment... just my few cents...
it's hard to take this comment seriously when most bid bot owners have consistentl sold all their earnings and not staked anything. Very few may have. Even people you have had an issue with in the past do keep selling hive like marky got rid of 1m hive earlier this year.
Once prices do better I'm sure more have their plans to get rid of some stake which would make hive more decentralized depending on who is buying all of it on exchanges.
I find myself easily annoyed by people pointing towards centralisation of stake on hive where so much of inflation goes to authors. You must really hate centralisation on quite literally every other chain to keep bringing such things up here.
We had once discussed about a list of the biggest stake holders, and obviously came to another conclusion about how many of them are early miners and former bidbot owners (in both cases including their alts) and how many not.
One thing I am happy to admit, is that in the recent months I didn't follow closely anymore who bought or sold what ...
Anyway, what I don't like is the typical HIVE attitude suggesting that all others (including the market!) are just completely wrong since years and just have no clue, bitcoin has no use case (well, I added a link to my comment above to name quite a few) and HIVE is so great, but the stupid people just don't recognize it. There IS (as always when the market reigns) a reason why the HIVE price is where it is and there is a reason why the bitcoin price is where it is.
Hive has enormous potential, but I think a bit more humility and acknowledgment of its weaknesses — alongside highlighting its very real strengths — would resonate better with potential new users and investors outside the Hive bubble. Unconditional hype and the implication that everyone else is just too dumb to recognize how great Hive is won't win people over!
Maybe I should add one thing: despite my internal criticism I always suggest using HIVE when I discuss with anybody outside of our 'bubble' about social media, cryptocurrencies or blockchain.
No one said that, I clearly stated in the beginning that people just don't know enough about Hive. Most aren't even aware that inflation will drop to 0.95% in 10 years but everyone knows about the bitcoin halving even though they're not really "active" on bitcoin.
The market has repeatedly proven to be wrong because it is overall easy to fake. Look how long it took for Monero to appreciate in price when there's millions of people wanting true anonymous transactions. Look how Tron is still a top 10 coin when it's founder does shadier activities than FTX.
No one's asking people to go all in on Hive or spend what they can't afford to lose, I'm just pointing out that not everyone is aware of certain specifications like tokenomics and usecases for Hive even after having been here a long time because to newbies just doing social things is enough and they don't bother to dig deeper or get stuck because all the info isn't in your face all the time.
Post was about being bullish on Hive and its utility and comparing it to the utility of bitcoin and ethereum yet you always love showing up being all negative and bringing up things that have happened almost a decade ago. Go do something productive.
The ninjamin was turned into the DHF, people who mined hive early aren't ninja-miners, only steemit was the ninjaminer because they didn't tell the public when steem initially launched to mine in secret, that's where the term ninja comes from.
The max supply is indeed a good point on btc... And yea when there's social stuff around and politics its all dividing, like Facebook... If btc had a social side, it wouldn't be different I guess, but you can earn out of posting while with btc either mine or buy
The good thing with HIVE - I agree - is, that you can save your experiences, ideas and thoughts on a blockchain.
I believe in Hive and that's why I'm here, it has evolved a lot, and my stay is based on blockchain is decentralized, you own your account, you can create content that I like, you generate rewards, the Hive is low, but I like the platform, I need more learning, here I go, I am optimistic the growth of Hive is on the rise.
I am bullish enough that the thought of passing on the 50/50 split of HBD is very tempting and going 100% HP payouts instead. We shall see after I spend my current liquid HBD on a cup of coffee just to use the Spend HBD feature. I still think Hive is the best chain around since you can store data so easily and essentially for free. Who am I kidding we get paid to store data here!
The possibilities of what Hive can do are endless!
For me, Hive is better option to invest than HBD and I do that.
HBD is really good but in crypto I believe that we should look for coin value appreciation than a fixed APR. I have gone through HIVE historical price and its at low price this time. Hive should be around $4-5
I've often said I think HIVE as a platform and a token are the answer to a question most people aren't asking yet. As governments and web2 corporations become more and more oppressive, people will start asking. And we have a decade of proof that our answer works.
I see it as 100% positive and I clearly understand the advantages of being in Hive. I will continue to grow and contribute to see Hive continue to expand.
I've always been bullish on HIVE. That's why I keep coming back pretty much every day. I think it's just a general feeling right now that people are kind of bearish on all alts. Hopefully that flips soon.
LoL yeah watch what happens when hive pumps x2 again and general sentiment shifts to "hm the 15% yield on HBD is garbage compared to a mooning token". Happens every time. Sell the bottom buy the top always.
I really liked the part where you compared Hive to Bitcoin and Ethereum.
You're right that the most important advantage here is the human interaction and the ability to make a direct impact within the platform.
I've only been a couple of months on Hive. It's not only about the rewards but the community as well. As a gamer, I can tell how important it is to have like minds who share your interest in gaming. There are even dozens of gaming communities that don't offer rewards for talking about your gaming experience and yet they have members, Hive does this and you get rewards as well. That's a win-win in my dictionary.
Can't really say. I thinking I'm bullish, for one I know that hive would blow up and outlast a lot of other chains.
I don't usually take note of tokenomics but I do know that it is profitable in the long term to get hive power and be able to get rewards from numerous shores because of the HP.
Sure HBD conversions is quicker but nothing is like that steady inflow of passive income that HP can bring.
Always bullish on Hive - I haven't come across such an interesting social media platform that is able to incorporate crypto into its model, and like you said, it's been around for so long!
I convert every dollar I get to liquid hive, I don't care about dollar value, I care about the number of hive I can collect because I have faith that it will go up multiple times when the time is right. :)
( a lesson I learned from 2017 bull run)
You just improved my vocabulary regarding HIVE, I always explained it in a very basic way, now I have the support to justify its use and application.
I am very optimistic, I still don't understand many things, I am constantly learning about Hive, however with the little I know about Jive, I am amazed by its great technology, its currency, the community and the growth we can achieve every day if you are consistent.
This post gave me a whole new appreciation for Hive. The downvote and unvote tools alone make it feel like we have actual community power, not just some devs up high pulling strings.
Just curious about it. Which one is better buying hive and powering up or buying HBD then staking for the APR .
I mean the whole post is about Hive, but sure. :D
HBD is meant to stay at $1, if the 15% APR holds is up to the top 20 witnesses, they may decide to increase or decrease it over time.
Hive doesn't have a boundary that way, it can go to $0.10 or lower potentially or it can go to $1 and higher and let's you do a lot of cool things with it like directing new rewards to posts and comments, voting for witnesses and proposals and helping fund different things on chain that may benefit you and the whole ecosystem.
While HBD, it just sits there and does nothing really.
Oh i see, no wonder i observed mostly holds hive than HBD atleast for now i got some clarity..
I guess that I am bullish enough to hoard every Hive that I get via my author, curation and witness rewards. I even bought a little bit of Hive and powered it up, but I am not bullish enough to really get into Hive to the point where I am ready to invest a significant amount into Hive.
If I learned that HIVE is going to be available to buy on Coinbase that would change my mind to the point I would put say 10k USD in it, but right now the availability of on ramps and off ramps for US buyers is just not there...
We need Hive to be listed on major exchanges so that it can really take off when the mass adoption comes.
I love both Hive and HBD. I am powering up all my rewards. But I am also not converting HBD to Hive. In a few months I will likely start buying HBD again. I already reached my Hive goal for the end of the year(12k) and it seems that I will surpass it by a good margin. But I am still far away from my HBD yearly goal(2k). I want to at some point have like 50-60k HP and 10-20k HBD. One of the reasons I like HBD is because I could unstake it faster should some kind of emergency arise. Also at 10-20k HBD that APR would start making a real difference in my life.
Demand for a coin is outside the source code. We cannot predict with certainty that anything will go up in value in the short term or even at all.
Id keep it all in hbd if the usd wasnt printed so willy nilly.
There are three very convincing reasons why.
Downvotes are a partial solution to some of them but it's not a good user experience.
The more I'm here the less i know, I'm afraid.
I am actually super bearish. Im super bearish because I see people still complaining about getting a downvote here and there, on a chain where they consistently earn crypto.
I am under the impression that a bear can do more damage than a bull to those people. With the claws and paws and stuff. They run with bulls in Pamplona and not with bears for a reason. Therefor I am bearish.
I'm starting to get quite annoyed of the "ok but what about this one bad thing that happens 0.015% of the time" crowd.
I am an optimist, I am starting in hive and I am learning
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I prefer both Hive and HBD.
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I would say I remain optimistic because I am aware of Hive potential.
I've been on the Blockchain for 4 years now and I honestly admit that I'm still not quite adapted to the environment, I've learned a lot of things as I go along, but I'm not an expert.
I'm just an average user and that's enough for me.
Hive is a unique experience for each person, and I think everyone understands it in their own way according to their perspective.
We have to keep our eyes on the future, on the next 10 years, we have to have good expectations for good things to come for everyone.