Around Hive, there have been several posts claiming that wearing masks is a scam, or that everyone wearing masks wouldn't accomplish anything to slow the spread of viral disease
Most of this claim isn't backed up with anything, but sometimes there are citations and links to irrelevant information. Most of the links indicate "wearing a mask doesn't stop you from getting infected". This is long known information, and was the reason that many people got the message "wearing a mask doesn't do anything". It's not information relevant to slowing the spread of disease, and thus opening up hospital space by reducing the number of active cases at any one time
Rather than try to track everyone down, maybe people could come here and let me know what their thinking is
Reviews of literature make it clear that wearing masks in a community significantly slows transmission of viral disease in general, and Covid19 specifically. Here's a recent summary of available information: https://files.fast.ai/papers/masks_lit_review.pdf
Reasoning from principles indicates the same:
- There's a lot of virus in snot and spit (it's how it spreads)
- Masks reduce the amount of snot and spit being sprayed into a room
Therefore, wearing masks reduces the amount of virus being sprayed into a room
Here are some fun videos showing why mask usage likely works as seen in the previously mentioned evidence
Mythbusters slow motion sneezes:
https://go.discovery.com/tv-shows/mythbusters/videos/slow-motion-sneezes/
Slow motion, various masks, various activities from a group at University of New South Wales:
Slow motion, 4k of how a mask impacts the spraying of spit and snot:
So what do you think?
Why would wearing masks within a given population not reduce the risk of disease transmission during a pandemic?
What flaws are in the evidence or reasoning?
Y'all have good
Part of my issue is that we are designed to get sick and get over it. This idea of slowing the spread actually just prolongs the inevitability of you getting something that is relatively normal and not very harmless, statistically speaking. Get it and get it over with. No masks.
It prolongs the inevitability of the getting it, sure, but enough people have severe enough reactions that places run out of hospital and morgue space
As the hospitals run out of space, they have to cancel other treatments or turn people away that would otherwise be able to receive care for non covid19 issues
If El Paso has good mask compliance, they wouldn't be stacking bodies in trucks
If Idaho had good mask compliance, they wouldn't be turning people away from the hospitals
Did someone or something give you the impression that the goal was to stop people from getting covid19 altogether? Or is it something else - like the hospitals are trying to trick us, or the morgue is in kahoots with some scheme?
edit:
Thank you for replying! It's good to get a perspective I hadn't even considered: the idea that there's no harm in the rate of spread
Things are too politicized and hyperbolic.
So from your point of view, the hospitals aren't telling the truth about being out of capacity and turning away patients? I know the patients are really being turned away as I know several. Why would hospital CEOs take the monetary loss? The drug company gives them some kind of kick back? Hard to imagine these large companies voluntarily declining money
And are the morgues also in on it? Someone does something to trick or force the coroners into not processing the bodies and storing them in strange ways?
There's a problem. Masks solve the problem. Your responses are on tangents not related to the problem at hand and the efficacy of masks in solving that problem. Is that intentional?
I've already said more than I wanted to. Can't have views nowadays that contradict groupthink.
Hold my beer m8 ... ;-)
I was originally replying to this text from cpmlxty:
Ref:
https://hiveblocks.com/tx/09a80ab07f4f0bc2caef56bdec41185c0fe346e7
https://hiveblocks.com/tx/eae5af0c9a39eacf14c47f0a571ab9be13b7c74d
https://hiveblocks.com/tx/f202fb46582467b5cf3396c3e3c244ab6b88a6cd
Well thanks for proving my point that I stay away from all discussions like this. Blockchain permanence is great but additionally dangerous, for this exact reason. Take care.
Sweden tried this Brother and it didn't work x)
It's funny because no one made this argument before COVID.
If you asked anyone before COVID they'd tell you masks probably do help.
Now the issue has been weirdly politized.
In other countries (especially east asia), it's considered polite to wear a mask when you have the common cold. That way, you're spreading less of whatever crud you picked up with the people around you. For densely populated areas like Tokyo or Shanghai, this is actually a really important thing for reducing the spread of whatever crud is going around!
What I find especially fascinating is how this is becoming a government mandate instead of a "don't be a dick" campaign. You would think that people would be more concerned with how they look to others, especially in the era of social media. Look at r/publicfreakout. They've had a field day with the Karens flipping shit over mask policies. Nobody in their right mind ever wants to be featured on there. It's a mark of ridicule, a point of derision, to be feature there. If you show up on there, you're an idiot and:
I would think a campaign to not be ridiculed for being obtuse would work better for ensuring compliance and convincing others to consider the lives of those around them.
It is interesting how it became a hot button issue. Presumably, some of it is the "DON"T TELL ME WHAT TO DO!" knee-jerk reaction that hopefully everybody has 😅
Without the mask, that vape would be shooting straightforward several feet. The mask keeps it around his head. Looks about the same as what's shown in the videos from the main post
Yes, I have a huge vape 😂
The masks he's demonstrating appear to do exactly what is expected and demonstrates why it helps stop the spread, most of the material expelled stays around the human expelling it and is given more time to dry before interacting with other humans. Literally, the benefit of the mask is to not shoot bodily fluids on to other humans. The videos in root post and this one show exactly that benefit
Do you think a lot of people were under the assumption that the mask somehow filtered all the outgoing air and cleaned it of virus? That would definitely explain some of the stuff I see
Cover you cough... wear a mask if you're sick. Get in a car and your Uber driver is sick... the mask is unlikely to help.
Studies before this year couldn't even show masks helped in OR conditions. The Danish mask study found no effect any way they sliced the data but couldn't get it published until they said this somehow proves more people needed masks.
I'm not against people wearing masks, but the government set up HIPAA and basically backed themselves into a corner. They can't mandate them at large, and there is no evidence they should.
Why this is a touchy subject... mostly just feelings. It's easier to virtue signal than to make less trips out and stay at home. Overall mortality didn't even change. Sweden did nothing and had approximately the same number of deaths as 2018, and had three worse flu seasons in my life.
Worst death rates were in heavily locked down countries like Peru. The only thing this looks like is Government killing people to me, if not from Orwellian lock downs with the famines and poverty that will ensue.
😂 Going well outside the scope of reducing spread here, but I dig it
I think "cover your cough" is the key part. If you think that works, then it seems to follow that covering your "F"s would also work (if you watch the videos "F" sounds create quite a spray). So many people cough without covering. If covering your cough helps, and everybody covers their coughs and Fs, then it seems to follow that spread would be reduced
And totally, being less than 6 feet away from someone would remove a lot of the efficacy from hands, elbows, or masks
Less trips out is the biggest one for helping... depending on where you live. There is a strong correlation between infection and mortality rates with population density. IDK why nobody covers it, but it was by far the strongest correlation in any data I could find to mine. Makes sense - stake a thousand people in one building and it's gonna spread to way more people than a thousand people each on their own sq mile
As far as death rates, I'm not seeing your claims in the data I have. Do you have a link for this? Last I checked Sweden was in a big mess and on lock down. Not sure what you mean about the metrics for Sweden at all. Their numbers are very high
https://twitter.com/aier while they're still on twitter this is where most of my stats started from.
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/
https://knoema.com/atlas/Sweden/Death-rate
Thank you!
I see what you're saying in the deathrate. Been on a long decline and seems to continue. The claim that they "did nothing" is pretty far fetched given all the actions taken, but I do see what you're saying about the death rate
Have you seen any studies around population density? Seems like the key factor when I mine it (retired "big data" guy), but I never see anyone talking about it. In my mind, if you're worried about covid, get outta the big cities... but I don't see anyone making that medical recommendation 😂
Yeah, that strikes me as accurate as well, the less people you interact with (shared ventilation, metros, taxis) the less chances for spread in the first place. Nursing homes would be a terrible environment... people in rural areas... safer from this at least. Maybe not have great hospital access though(if that's a place you want to go).
Denmark have been on a crazy lockdown where all shops are closed besides pharma and supermarkets and we have to wear mask in every store.
And look at the numbers now. Its down from 4K mid December to around 1K.
So fk your misinfomation, I live here.
You likely wouldn't know that the death rate in Denmark has been on the rise for 4 years and 2020 was a slight pullback from a bigger trend. More people aren't dying... and one day we'll realize this.
This also shows why it's useless to argue about. You state very loudly you have personal bias. Only time will tell.
I appreciate this sane and socially-responsible post. If we all spread facts, not fiction & thought of others, beside ourselves, we’d be in better shape, now!
I do wear my mask, to avoid infecting others, cause I could, maybe be infected with no symptoms without knowing it.
I am ashamed that other people do not follow that simple politness gesture.
That's a good point that I don't think had come up in this thread. If we only mask when we feel sick, the spread doesn't really slow down much
Thank you for your consideration of others! It isn't always easy to care, but it really makes the world a much nicer place
Some people prefer to believe in ridiculous conspiracies. Once they've hit that point, I don't think they can be salvaged. Fucking idiots.
Thanks for the post about the topic
https://swprs.org/covid-masks-review/
This is like one of those things I mentioned where the data
doesdoesn't back up the claim. I clicked through the link, read the source... and they say there isn't a lot of data and controlled experiments were limited (not done on a whole town or country or whatever)They conclude the mask section with:
How someone can read that and reach the conclusion that masks don't help reduce the rate of infection is strange to me. It is misinformation with a link to real information... and the real information doesn't back the claim. I see a lot of this going around twitter. I assume most people just aren't clicking through to review the sources
Unfortunately, medical issues have become politicized. It's like asking a physicist to calculate how beautiful a picture is.
Ye well. People are idiots foxon x)
$tangent
Congratulations @foxon! You have completed the following achievement on the Hive blockchain and have been rewarded with new badge(s) :
You can view your badges on your board and compare yourself to others in the Ranking
If you no longer want to receive notifications, reply to this comment with the word
STOP@deathwing check this our
This goes to show what we thought we knew about viruses and disease transmissions are all misinformation...
Yeah buddy , keep re-breathing your own shit true that face cloth , make a nice bio-hazard from it , keep it warm by breathing , make it grow big .. very very healthy indeed . Throw it away in nature , make more animals choke on it , be a good brave human ,... listen to Fauchi , worship Bill , ... and never think for yourself in any way . ... What a bright light you are !
Well , i think one day you will solve yourself , .. the problem , lol .
Preach!