The catalyst was when johan, a previous steemit employee and a non-witness, decided to clone steem, create what he called Hardfork 21: Freedom which "[if] this hardfork is adopted by witnesses will set all Steemit Inc. controlled accounts authorities to the null key.
The man is a genius. I'm already spreading the news on twitter :)
and wasn't it @dan who proposed nullifying steemit inc accounts and wasn't it about witness voting since steemit inc fully controlled previously
also it seems this is too little too late as the majority has already been cashed from steemit ic accounts already over the last 2 years not to mention all the farming accounts
i didn't mean it shouldn't be done,
but that if it were say one year ago when the millions were cashed out through the @tostitos account would be vastly different as this coincided with the massive rise in prices and the drop off in the quality of content and flag management on the platform that barely exists today in comparison
It was based on a previous though unimplemented hardfork code change that was written by steemit at a previous time that intended to set authorities to the null key for a different list of accounts
Actually I believe it was based on a Steemit-developed fork which WAS implemented. I could be wrong though, I haven't reviewed the code fragments personally and have heard this stated by others.
Rare communication from a CTO would be fine. Rare communication from the CEO and defacto overall community leader is inexcusable
I would say this depends actually. CTO can be a communications driver and this works quite well for some other companies and crypto projects, particularly when the CTO is a visionary with good communications skills and communication is development-focused (such as when the platform is immature and in a phase of constant development). What is really more important is that there be someone doing it.
HF20 allows for discount account creation tokens, but the flagship app of the platform doesn't let you claim or use them and effectively we're in the same spot as a community where onboarding new users is still a bad and unclear experience
Add to this that the @steem account has stockpiled about 30k free account tokens, and rather than loosening the restrictions and allowing more users to sign up, in fact there have been fewer, and now there is talk of transitioning to a paid signup model. This is insanity.
Indeed! As if half of the world would be waiting to join STEEM. We urgently need new users, much more than they need us - so we should make it as easy and pleasant as possible for them to join! Even if it is for free, I always have to work hard to convince new people to create a STEEM account. Most of them wouldn't sign up if the first thing they had to do was paying for it.
I have had to pay to open accounts for others, because I knew if they waited for @steemit to open their accounts, they would have lost interest and probably ignored the email after waiting for weeks.
Sometimes it feels like they brainstormed all the things that would prevent new users, almost as affectively as they made it to mine the coin, that has created the skewed distribution of STEEM power amongst users.
Thank you for the live-streamed discussion. @aggroed we've read the initiative and we're interested to see how we can fit in (or otherwise) towards a formation of a "Steem Council".
I actually don't need to add anything since you've put what matters right on point. But I want to mention that I'm interested in taking action in your committee proposal.
I will take some time to reflect which kind of committe fits best to my strength & knowledge, but so far the dApp aspect is something I could see myself in, since I'm already focusing on it due to SteemApps.com.(and the connections with it to multiple other dApp sites â state of the dapps, dapponline, dapp.com, etc)
But in any way - I'm also looking forward to see, what @ned has planned with his Mission Value Vision (MVV) document, coming soon.
With that said, thank you for your commitment and if anybody has 50 minutes, then please listen to the recording at the beginning of this post. It's worth it!
i was meaning everything @ned says in talks seems closed in to certain points and phrases as if scripted by others and he finds difficulty talking around
p.s due to miscroll i only noticed the video was here not to come lol
What a great initiative @aggroed!
I just listened to the entire recording and am happy i did.
Nice move from you to get on voice @ned and good to hear you’ve recovered from your illness! Be careful with your resources 😉
You all provided some very valuable input with regards to more interaction between Steemit, Inc and the community. A discord run by the HQ is actually overdue and would be a true win-win for all participants. Also having a roadmap with those ‘goals’ you mentioned Ned would be a great adding and valuable step towards more transparency.
In the end it may be your vision, Ned - but you may want us to live it up together with you.
This is how I summarize the relationship between Ned and the community.
Nice words were spoken it felt like platitudes.
Look ladies and gents, he is just not that into you. (us)
Doesn't make him a bad guy, we just aren't his thing.
Ah, @whatsup...I didn't know this was your post til I checked to see who had me lol to the rooftops...still lol...Peace....gotta' love it! I didn't bother to listen...kinda' like the relationship you're over; but, the 'splainin' continues....lol...
I needed a good lol... and this one brought me to tears while uncontrollably l'ing ol...Every time I read this song is called....I start all over again...literally can't stop laughing...tears flowing...I better get a grip before long....lol....
I find it interesting that Ned is all about building communities but he has zero communication skills. I can't dislike him because he seems to be being true to himself. I'd rather he was real than trying to be something he isn't. Hopefully the Steem community can make up for Ned's obvious faults and he can be free to be Ned. I don't think we can rely on him but maybe something good will come from the world of Ned one day. I can imagine his guitar videos being in a film but the script would be somewhat unbelievable.
Thanks Aggy, this was great! I didn't actually realise Johan was an ex-employee, I just thought he was the genius behind the super excellent dSteem.
Not enough interviews/conversations have the phrase "calm your tits" in them... so good! I think if a regular forum with Ned or proxy were to happen, I'd probably be happier to have just one host who asked questions... having a number of voices pipe in was distracting, especially when we really wanted to hear Ned's answer, not necessarily another person's opinion on why the question is important to be answered. I thought Aggy, that you hit the right tone. I would never want Ned to feel attacked or frustrated, but you also didn't necessarily let him get away with not answering questions.
The Steem Council is a brilliant idea and I really think it'll help the entire ecosystem... at the very least by filtering the best ideas upwards, but obviously providing direction, and herding the cats into the same direction would improve literally everything.
I would hope that the Steem Council could operate regardless of a Steemit SP donation - I imagine a lot of people would be happy to donate their time to help form the direction of the group. Lots of committees work on an elected yet voluntary basis, which is good because I'm not super confident Steemit would part with it's SP if it's required to pay for some of the costs... but the Steem committee should be able to operate as an equal partner to Steemit, not because of it.
I like Ned, but I do think he feels that the community is his customer-base, not his co-investors... and in his defense, there are pockets of the overall community that is a little nuts... but honestly I'd be happy with an AGM or a shareholder quarterly meeting to get an idea of where Steemit is heading, and then for us all to go back to building.
@aggroed I incredibly appreciate how you handled the conversation - calm tone of voice, keeping a friendly connection at all times, hitting on the difficult questions, very clear thinking.
@ned I really appreciate your openness to suggestions and keeping cool and calm even when faced with difficult questions. I would have enjoyed more concrete answers to some of the questions. I think the next thing we would all like to see is your willingness to engage in crafting and implementing solutions that will benefit everyone.
Good that conversation is starting again. Thanks @aggroed and @ned Next step could be to identify small pieces of work to be done in a joint effort by Steemit Inc and Steem community, be it technical, marketing ...or what ever. There are a lot of ideas put forward in the SOS-forums.
Concerning the fit of committees as organisational form for a decentralised community there has already been an intense and critical debate after the second SOS-forum amongst @bigtom13@bluerobo@imacryptorick@pennsif@rycharde@starkerz@shadowspub and me.
Check here (3 minutes read) and in the SOS-discord
Please check and participate before going along this pathway. I'll be happy to discuss this with you in more detail and definitely offer to be actively involved.
Thanks for opening this dialogue @aggroed,
It would be so cool to simple see a Steemit inc. town hall discord set up for all of these discussions. Its the most neutral platform for these types of conversations to happen!
Regarding the structure of this on the blockchain: This should be a multi proof of brain free market of ideas super structure, with zero leaders in my view. That is what blockchain is for. If we create committees as part of the top level, we will centralize and produce powerful gate keepers over time (as every other community in history has done). We have an opportunity here to build something with a decentralized community structure, with organized committees operating below this structure voluntarily, not appointed.
@aggroed, thanks for trying to ask the questions that we all wanted the answers to. Your point of view is very similar to my own and i think that the community would love to take over a lot of aspects of the blockchain. I'm afraid Ned didn't fill me with confidence with his answers as there was a lot of fluff and talking around the questions. I hope that i'm wrong but it doesn't look like he is going anywhere fast.
Excellent work, Aggroed. Thank you for continually working to build community and not just point out problems, but always offer solutions as well. I think you summarized things very well including the unmet expectations of the community and a desire (even need) for change. We can not keep doing the same thing and expect a different result.
THX a lot aggroed and fyrstikken... great job!! Highly appreciated!
would have wished @ned to give numbers..
cash burn in the past, cash burn now, cash burn after the intended tech changes...
as steem resembles in many ways a kind of stock investment (also it is not a investment in legal terms) I might be a good idea if there would be a kind of quarterly report.. including a letter from ned to his fellow stake holder... reporting some numbers... e.g. cash burn, tokens sold, reserves, etc... and timeline and advances for new developments....
this should help a lot and would be a premier in the crypto space...
I have to say, I find some tension, even contradiction, between speaking of moving to a decentralized model, and then turning right around and suggesting we move to a handful of committees to manage all this public Steem Power and mined Steem.
Which is it? Decentralized? Or just moving the central repository of power from Ned to other people?
And how will the elections go? Is it going to be true democracy, in the form of "1 person, 1 vote", which obviously runs into the issue of bots and multiple accounts, or will it be like the Witnesses situation, where your SP allows you to have more say in who gets elected?
In which case, again, more centralization, rather than less. Currently we have the whales and Steemit. Under this proposed system, we'll give the whales the keys to the kingdom.
That is, honestly, more centralization, not less.
I strongly recommend inviting some people who are not invested in Steemit to both help run the system, and to help design a better system. Those people will be unbiased, and be able to make good suggestions. Otherwise, what I'm seeing is, the people with the power making sure they end up with more of it. Yes, you invested in the system, but you're not the only one who have. Outside board-members are a good thing to have.
Well, I thought of having a voting system where you have to confirm that you are not a bot - and then 1 person 1 vote, would be a real democratic decision.
Thank you for speaking up. This is my gut feeling too. We need people that are smart and capable and unbiased to be helping those that are already here...invested and otherwise.
I don't have time to listen to the whole thing but I laughed when @fyrstikken jumped in and spoke up and said "We haven't heard from you in like a year! " Hahhahah
I really like the idea of forming comittees. The only marketing we have right now is word-of-mouth, which obviously will be not successful if the Steem price is down. I have seen a dramatic decrease in posts over the last few weeks, mostly due to the bear market we a currently facing. It is unclear what the future holds for us, whether Steem will become a social media blockchain or will serve for blogging only. A really good initiative is Utopian.io - because it supports meaningful work in the open-source section. Another really good one is Steemstem, supporting science in every aspect. I think in the long run we should definitely form other initiatives for other topics f.ex. Sports, Health, Law, Astronomy, Travel, Lifehacks etc. This platforms are going to enhance the quality of the posts, because everyone tries to do his or her best in order to get a vote. This will inevitably draw more attention from outside to the blockchain. I think just a copy of Facebook or Twitter with a reward system won't be enough to draw the masses to our blockchain. We are going to need a big and vital community, with lots of talent and lots of knowledge in different fields. Knowledge which can only be found on the Steem Blockchain and no where else. We have to face the question, what our Unique Selling Proposition ('USP') really is.
Thank you for this thoughtful, thorough and candid account/outline @aggroed. I’m sorry I missed the show — I was nose deep in SM book design — didn’t even remember it was Sunday. I’ll have to listen to the recording later. 🙌🏼 Thanks again for all you do. It’s clear that you sincerely care about this place. ⭐️
@aggroed, this is a great post. Thanks for taking the time and energy in standing up for the community.
@ned, you are a visionary, but visionaries can't stand alone. The community is here to support and sustain you, but we can't do that if you're absent.
The Circa team is working on a community organization and project incubation tool could greatly assist in the creation of a decentralized council/committee network as discussed above. Our front-end tools and real-time dashboards will allow Steem users to create and set skills & abilities, adopt Steem #domains, and create Steem-based trust accounts that distributed earnings daily to all council/commitee members. Due to the absence of working SMTs, we are hoping to launch using custom @wavesplatform tokens. We are currently in development but have some of the most basic features working. We hope to have a public Alpha test later this week.
@Aggroaed, this is awesome step. I carefully went through this https://hackmd.io/EzrGbFQdQ0yGRtrx4lGQ3w?edit# and it made a great sense. It's a well thought out plan for Steem's leadership. However, here are my suggestions while we still hope for the Feb. 2 meet:
Wouldn't you make a roll of viable communities on the Steem blockchain to send in delegates (3). May be, peg a minimum SP to be held by a community qualified to be represented in the Council. The SP, say, 50,000 is such that must have been held at least in the last 2 months. Sometimes, I had made a call for community reorganization and harmonization on the Steem blockchain, if the blockchain must grow sustainably. WHere communities are well managed with regulated (not confined) operation options and ranges, Steem leadership council would be viable.
On the tenure of the proposed Council, 2 years seems too long. There should be openings for periodical evaluation by the users at a shorter duration in order to help check excesses and power corruption.
There also should be measures to break the whale-plankton dichotomy which sometimes enhances user-abuse.
Glad to see our Fyrst in here, Ned came to SteemSpeak the other night and had a conversation. Glad he went on MSP too. Many people have been concerned and maybe this will ease some of their concerns.
@aggroed wants to be CEO while @ned plays guitar. At this point I'd be ok with that. Either that or he needs to do this sometimes and needs @juliekponsford or someone like her to be his community outreach.
I don't dislike @ned, but this conversation is 2 years too late. If he was doing this once or twice a month I'd have no issues with his as a frontman. I'd feel like at least we know what we are doing here, whether we agree or disagree. It's not only a matter of showing up, it's about dialogue and respect towards the community, not treating us like idiots, not sugar coating things, and not being unable to apologize when you mess up. No one cares about how well you play guitar when the platform is falling apart. Fix it and we'll all be happy to watch you play then.
This is by far the best post I have read in my 18 months on Steem. I learned so much from it and have now a better perspective to where we come from and where we should go. Please @ned, listen to Aggroed, who has earned himself a respect here on so many levels, very few others have achieved so far. If Steem wants to thrive, we have to communicate and work together. Let's enfold the real hivemind that is still slumbering here. We have proven before how quickly the community can come together to push Steem. Make use of that!
I agree, one of the best posts I've read...just shows how poor the steemit comm has been over the years laying out the true history and lay of the land on steem block chain.
Hi, certainly the downturns in Steem creates distrust and many people go away because of ignorance, this type of conversations help us to understand a little more and to see the effort that some make so that this blockchain can be more reliable and grow.
Hi @aggroed, I'm @checky ! While checking the mentions made in this post I noticed that @disregardingfiat doesn't exist on Steem. Maybe you made a typo ?
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How would we create an open governance? Would it be made up of all people or just the important stakeholders( not my opinion as we ARE ALL IMPORTANT) aka whales and top 20 witnesses? I am curious how you would move forward and what you see a governance.
I would remove the word "Committees" and replace it with "Community teams". Committees makes it sound like the worst of communism.
I do think development needs to be opened but the problem is how many groups are willing to fund the initiative to train and bring in new development teams? I would also like to see a research initiative. I mentioned for example VDF and randomness beacons as an idea for Steem but I notice there is a lack of discussion or organized community for research into these new technological opportunities.
As a result Steemit and SMTs are really the only concrete ideas on the table which has received popular discussion.
A large part of the reason those are the only ideas on the table is the closed development process and that those are the only ideas that have been promoted and pushed by Steemit, even though they have not been able to deliver on them to any significant degree.
This is a broken ecosystem, and some profound restructuring is needed as a precondition to make it work better before more, and better, work can actually get done. @aggroed is correct about that (as are you).
Agree re "Committees". The model that seems to work best in the cryptocurrency marketplace is a foundation to govern that the funds are managed responsibly and then developers are hired or given grants (on a project and/or ongoing basis) to do the work. It isn't committees or even teams that do the work, it is developers (and marketers, lawyers, etc. depending on the nature of the work that needs to be done). The foundation or what some are calling committees exist to oversee the thing and make sure that money isn't wasted or stolen.
I would like to see steemit.com run as a private for profit company with the intent of making it the best social site in the world, that just so happens to have one of the best cryptocurrencies attached to it.
Letting the steemit,inc team work on the steem blockchain and turning over steemit.com to a different team seems like the best approach to me.
And yes the selling of 800,000 steem per month has to stop.
This is a model that I think would actually work, though perhaps not the only one: Split off Steem (blockchain) from steemit (social web site) each with its own funding and governance. Steemit Inc the for profit company can build and run steemit.com as one of the apps backed by the Steem cryptocurrency and blockchain, and a community governance structure and/or foundation can develop the code for the Steem blockchain.
I'm not sold on the idea of Steemit Inc developing the blockchain. Blockchains are inherently a community resource and a private unaccountable company developing them is always a bit of a strain. It can probably work with an excellent team and excellent management with the right vision and approach but that doesn't seem to be the case here and I see no reason to expect that to change in the future (beyond wishful thinking, which I reject as a plan).
I could get on board with this as well. My main goal was just that I would like to see them separated. I also would like to see them follow through with implementing some advertising and then maybe a revenue sharing model or some gamification of some kind to provide alternative revenue streams for users.
I guess I would STRONGLY advocate for an additional Committee:
Call it what you will but, essentially: The People's Committee.
The committee for issues within the community. Similar in roles and governance, to the other committees mentioned, however, it would ultimately, have someone serving that would in essence serve as an employee of the PEOPLE, to bring the voice of the people back to the governance of the Blockchain. A Steemit Ombudsmen.
In essence, the committee charter would be retention, and steemian issues.
Thanks for writing the post and explaining about the background (ninja mine) and the catalyst (Hardfork 21 "Freedom")...
More people here on Steem should be aware of these "issues" in order to find a sustainable future for the whole community, not only for the witnesses and the visionary "leader".
Too bad the host was talking 90% of the time, and we could not hear more from the person in question.
The visions expressed by the "leader" on this show did not inspire me at all. On the other hand, the resent drama got the community together and amazing projects are in the making.
Its time to let the community take the lead, why do we have to wait for one person to act?
Maybe a hardfork is a positive way to leave the dark past behind and move to a brighter future of Steem.
This will be interesting.
Maybe now someone comes to help with the development?
I was expecting this from Utopian, but just quietness from that corner.
Maybe those tokens will lure them in.
Or prospect of committees
Now steem enters the phase of communism.
In its original definition :)
That was excellent @aggroed and @ned. You guys actually brought tears to my eyes a time or two and made me feel more hopeful than I have felt in months.Thank you.
when you know all the facts steem is 100% a security,
since one entity from the offset controlled a significant amount of the distribution of rewards and set about farming in the millions of SP for various steemit inc accounts whilst also controlling changes to system reward mechanisms etc
A well explained article. I got to know so many things from this article. I also would like to say that you have asked things in a nice way. Hoping to see some fruit from this.
Even I strongly believe in this chain and not really happy by the way it is progressing.
Litening to this recording why the hell don'e we make @Aggroed CEO and @ned the Chairman/Founder,
@ned just keeps skirting around the issues that #aggroed keeps asking him. He just is not on the ball as far as Communications in way a CEO should be. Not all.
Not even close. I know I had my issues with @aggroed in the past. Personal stuff which to be honest was just kind of silly on my part. But the more I listen to him he sounds like a CEO who is able to Communicate effectively.
You continue to earn your witness vote over and over again, thank you for keeping it real! There's literally no words to be added here, I wish Ned would take some example from you. Bravo!
I can't say if doing a coup d'etat against steemitinc will do good to the steem economy because if they can do it to the major stake holders what more for little ones.
Hi @aggroed, thanks for the historical insights and for pushing forward the need for concrete plans.
BTW Feb 2nd is a Saturday (not a Sunday); you may wish to edit either the day or date. I hope it is the Saturday so can participate, as in Asia will be the dead of night.
My own work and interest is in the economic system that Steem has created. This could be a sub-committee of the blockchain committee but it needs the skills and insights of mathematicians, economists, game theorists, systems analysts etc before looking at the encoding.
The field of cryptoeconomics is new and faces genuine challenges in creating autonomous systems that can adapt to human behaviour without either crashing or heading towards some unwanted attractor. Nobody has as yet created such a blockchain economy, hence it is worth doing.
We have seen that hard forks that affect the economic code can have dramatic effects on the system, hence any changes must not be taken lightly or without thorough testing. What is needed is a few people who truly understand how the Steem economic system works plus some new blood from the areas mentioned above.
The Steem blockchain is agnostic to human qualities and value judgments; it merely reacts to blockchain actions. I can see the current drive is to add a human layer above the pure coin flow, with the development of new websites and communities. However, there also needs to be a long hard look at the coin creation and distribution so that the steem macroeconomics actually facilitates the microeconomics of both the individual members and communities.
Thank you @aggroed, @frystikken, and @llfarms for doing this. I'm not sure if there was an agenda for Ned available before the show (perhaps not possible if he joined last min), but that could help him with his prep to not skate around some stuff we're keen on, which may not be so important to him.
Hey Matt! No, there was no agenda or questions lined up. He just happened to show up in audience and we invite anyone from the audience to come on air, which he chose to do. I think having his own scheduled forum would probably be most likely planned before hand and allow him to be a bit more specific and direct with answers etc. Or maybe he just didn’t want to give too much info 🤷🏻♀️ Who knows. But yes it was all very impromptu and no questions were known before hand. Glad he took the opportunity to chat and hope it happens more often as well as getting a bit more into the hard questions in a respectful way as well.
Particularly, announcing livestreams, abandoning them, and providing no further announcement is flatly unprofessional.
Indeed, just to disappear without any explanation ... would you behave like that when you had an appointment with a friend or a business partner? Just unthinkable!
Even no other person from the whole Steemit Inc. stuff provided any further information.
You built the most commonly used App in the crypto sphere and then sunset it.
Exactly: all the new already existing and planned DApps are really great, but we shouldn't forget that we already had (and still have) a unique feature which differentiates us from all other crypto currencies and blockchains: a functioning community, a social network that gives even non-crypto affine persons the possibility to enter a until now for them completely new world. We should make onboarding as easy and simple as possible and care much more about new users than we currently do. The value of other successful social media sites like facebook is not because of any superior technology but because of the huge and (more or less) satisfied user base!
The man is a genius. I'm already spreading the news on twitter :)
.
well really if @freedom and @blocktrades support since they such control over top 20 rankings
http://www.steemreports.com/witness-voters/
and wasn't it @dan who proposed nullifying steemit inc accounts and wasn't it about witness voting since steemit inc fully controlled previously
also it seems this is too little too late as the majority has already been cashed from steemit ic accounts already over the last 2 years not to mention all the farming accounts
I rather do too little too late than nothing too early ...
i didn't mean it shouldn't be done,
but that if it were say one year ago when the millions were cashed out through the @tostitos account would be vastly different as this coincided with the massive rise in prices and the drop off in the quality of content and flag management on the platform that barely exists today in comparison
Actually I believe it was based on a Steemit-developed fork which WAS implemented. I could be wrong though, I haven't reviewed the code fragments personally and have heard this stated by others.
I would say this depends actually. CTO can be a communications driver and this works quite well for some other companies and crypto projects, particularly when the CTO is a visionary with good communications skills and communication is development-focused (such as when the platform is immature and in a phase of constant development). What is really more important is that there be someone doing it.
Add to this that the @steem account has stockpiled about 30k free account tokens, and rather than loosening the restrictions and allowing more users to sign up, in fact there have been fewer, and now there is talk of transitioning to a paid signup model. This is insanity.
I'm glad all this talk is on the table, I was calling for this a month ago.
Indeed! As if half of the world would be waiting to join STEEM. We urgently need new users, much more than they need us - so we should make it as easy and pleasant as possible for them to join! Even if it is for free, I always have to work hard to convince new people to create a STEEM account. Most of them wouldn't sign up if the first thing they had to do was paying for it.
I have had to pay to open accounts for others, because I knew if they waited for @steemit to open their accounts, they would have lost interest and probably ignored the email after waiting for weeks.
Sometimes it feels like they brainstormed all the things that would prevent new users, almost as affectively as they made it to mine the coin, that has created the skewed distribution of STEEM power amongst users.
Thank you for the live-streamed discussion. @aggroed we've read the initiative and we're interested to see how we can fit in (or otherwise) towards a formation of a "Steem Council".
@aggroed, this is a fantastic initiative!
I actually don't need to add anything since you've put what matters right on point. But I want to mention that I'm interested in taking action in your committee proposal.
I will take some time to reflect which kind of committe fits best to my strength & knowledge, but so far the dApp aspect is something I could see myself in, since I'm already focusing on it due to SteemApps.com.(and the connections with it to multiple other dApp sites â state of the dapps, dapponline, dapp.com, etc)
But in any way - I'm also looking forward to see, what @ned has planned with his Mission Value Vision (MVV) document, coming soon.
With that said, thank you for your commitment and if anybody has 50 minutes, then please listen to the recording at the beginning of this post. It's worth it!
i personally look forward to whatever bullshit story @ned's team has this time
i hope they put more effort than the last
( ͡ᵔ ͜ʖ ͡ᵔ )
Team?
i was meaning everything @ned says in talks seems closed in to certain points and phrases as if scripted by others and he finds difficulty talking around
p.s due to miscroll i only noticed the video was here not to come lol
:-)
:-O
What a great initiative @aggroed!
I just listened to the entire recording and am happy i did.
Nice move from you to get on voice @ned and good to hear you’ve recovered from your illness! Be careful with your resources 😉
You all provided some very valuable input with regards to more interaction between Steemit, Inc and the community. A discord run by the HQ is actually overdue and would be a true win-win for all participants. Also having a roadmap with those ‘goals’ you mentioned Ned would be a great adding and valuable step towards more transparency.
In the end it may be your vision, Ned - but you may want us to live it up together with you.
Steem on 🤙
"Be careful with your resources 😉" Yes, according to Chinese medicine, too much masturbation is bad for the kidneys. Take care of yourself @ned
Sorry...that wink...had to...
A Korean summary for the KR community is as below.
한국어 버젼 요약본 만들어놨습니다.
https://steempeak.com/kr/@jayplayco/aggroed
Thanks for your effort and commitment @aggroed.
This is a must listen. Thank you for making it happen.
Super informative post...the kind of things most of us naive minnows and dolphins had no clue about.
Posted using Partiko Android
This is how I summarize the relationship between Ned and the community.
Nice words were spoken it felt like platitudes.
Look ladies and gents, he is just not that into you. (us)
Doesn't make him a bad guy, we just aren't his thing.
Ah, @whatsup...I didn't know this was your post til I checked to see who had me lol to the rooftops...still lol...Peace....gotta' love it! I didn't bother to listen...kinda' like the relationship you're over; but, the 'splainin' continues....lol...
I needed a good lol... and this one brought me to tears while uncontrollably l'ing ol...Every time I read this song is called....I start all over again...literally can't stop laughing...tears flowing...I better get a grip before long....lol....
Okay, now...
Peace.
hahahahah brilliant.
...but I am trying to give him the benefit of the benefit of the benefit of the doubt until Whaleshares or Narrative catch up.
Sure, like I said... he's not a bad guy. He just doesn't want to be friends.
my feeling too
Omg this is brilliant! Sums it up perfectly.
I find it interesting that Ned is all about building communities but he has zero communication skills. I can't dislike him because he seems to be being true to himself. I'd rather he was real than trying to be something he isn't. Hopefully the Steem community can make up for Ned's obvious faults and he can be free to be Ned. I don't think we can rely on him but maybe something good will come from the world of Ned one day. I can imagine his guitar videos being in a film but the script would be somewhat unbelievable.
Thanks Aggy, this was great! I didn't actually realise Johan was an ex-employee, I just thought he was the genius behind the super excellent dSteem.
Not enough interviews/conversations have the phrase "calm your tits" in them... so good! I think if a regular forum with Ned or proxy were to happen, I'd probably be happier to have just one host who asked questions... having a number of voices pipe in was distracting, especially when we really wanted to hear Ned's answer, not necessarily another person's opinion on why the question is important to be answered. I thought Aggy, that you hit the right tone. I would never want Ned to feel attacked or frustrated, but you also didn't necessarily let him get away with not answering questions.
The Steem Council is a brilliant idea and I really think it'll help the entire ecosystem... at the very least by filtering the best ideas upwards, but obviously providing direction, and herding the cats into the same direction would improve literally everything.
I would hope that the Steem Council could operate regardless of a Steemit SP donation - I imagine a lot of people would be happy to donate their time to help form the direction of the group. Lots of committees work on an elected yet voluntary basis, which is good because I'm not super confident Steemit would part with it's SP if it's required to pay for some of the costs... but the Steem committee should be able to operate as an equal partner to Steemit, not because of it.
I like Ned, but I do think he feels that the community is his customer-base, not his co-investors... and in his defense, there are pockets of the overall community that is a little nuts... but honestly I'd be happy with an AGM or a shareholder quarterly meeting to get an idea of where Steemit is heading, and then for us all to go back to building.
Thanks again Ags.
@aggroed I incredibly appreciate how you handled the conversation - calm tone of voice, keeping a friendly connection at all times, hitting on the difficult questions, very clear thinking.
@ned I really appreciate your openness to suggestions and keeping cool and calm even when faced with difficult questions. I would have enjoyed more concrete answers to some of the questions. I think the next thing we would all like to see is your willingness to engage in crafting and implementing solutions that will benefit everyone.
Good that conversation is starting again. Thanks @aggroed and @ned Next step could be to identify small pieces of work to be done in a joint effort by Steemit Inc and Steem community, be it technical, marketing ...or what ever. There are a lot of ideas put forward in the SOS-forums.
Concerning the fit of committees as organisational form for a decentralised community there has already been an intense and critical debate after the second SOS-forum amongst @bigtom13 @bluerobo @imacryptorick @pennsif @rycharde @starkerz @shadowspub and me.
Check here (3 minutes read) and in the SOS-discord
https://busy.org/@impactn/going-beyond-committees-an-answer-to-pennsif-and-starkerz
As a result just now there is a test run going on for decentralised strategy building without committees.
https://busy.org/@impactn/where-to-go-setting-up-a-strategy-for-the-future-of-steem-test-stage-1
Please check and participate before going along this pathway. I'll be happy to discuss this with you in more detail and definitely offer to be actively involved.
Thanks for opening this dialogue @aggroed,
It would be so cool to simple see a Steemit inc. town hall discord set up for all of these discussions. Its the most neutral platform for these types of conversations to happen!
Regarding the structure of this on the blockchain: This should be a multi proof of brain free market of ideas super structure, with zero leaders in my view. That is what blockchain is for. If we create committees as part of the top level, we will centralize and produce powerful gate keepers over time (as every other community in history has done). We have an opportunity here to build something with a decentralized community structure, with organized committees operating below this structure voluntarily, not appointed.
@aggroed, thanks for trying to ask the questions that we all wanted the answers to. Your point of view is very similar to my own and i think that the community would love to take over a lot of aspects of the blockchain. I'm afraid Ned didn't fill me with confidence with his answers as there was a lot of fluff and talking around the questions. I hope that i'm wrong but it doesn't look like he is going anywhere fast.
Excellent work, Aggroed. Thank you for continually working to build community and not just point out problems, but always offer solutions as well. I think you summarized things very well including the unmet expectations of the community and a desire (even need) for change. We can not keep doing the same thing and expect a different result.
You can, although that is the classic definition of insanity. 😎
THX a lot aggroed and fyrstikken... great job!! Highly appreciated!
would have wished @ned to give numbers..
cash burn in the past, cash burn now, cash burn after the intended tech changes...
as steem resembles in many ways a kind of stock investment (also it is not a investment in legal terms) I might be a good idea if there would be a kind of quarterly report.. including a letter from ned to his fellow stake holder... reporting some numbers... e.g. cash burn, tokens sold, reserves, etc... and timeline and advances for new developments....
this should help a lot and would be a premier in the crypto space...
MAKE STEEM GREAT AGAIN!
;-)
I have to say, I find some tension, even contradiction, between speaking of moving to a decentralized model, and then turning right around and suggesting we move to a handful of committees to manage all this public Steem Power and mined Steem.
Which is it? Decentralized? Or just moving the central repository of power from Ned to other people?
And how will the elections go? Is it going to be true democracy, in the form of "1 person, 1 vote", which obviously runs into the issue of bots and multiple accounts, or will it be like the Witnesses situation, where your SP allows you to have more say in who gets elected?
In which case, again, more centralization, rather than less. Currently we have the whales and Steemit. Under this proposed system, we'll give the whales the keys to the kingdom.
That is, honestly, more centralization, not less.
I strongly recommend inviting some people who are not invested in Steemit to both help run the system, and to help design a better system. Those people will be unbiased, and be able to make good suggestions. Otherwise, what I'm seeing is, the people with the power making sure they end up with more of it. Yes, you invested in the system, but you're not the only one who have. Outside board-members are a good thing to have.
Well, I thought of having a voting system where you have to confirm that you are not a bot - and then 1 person 1 vote, would be a real democratic decision.
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Thank you for speaking up. This is my gut feeling too. We need people that are smart and capable and unbiased to be helping those that are already here...invested and otherwise.
This could be an incentive to create an anonymous decentralized CAPCHA system which has been on my mind for well over a year.
I don't have time to listen to the whole thing but I laughed when @fyrstikken jumped in and spoke up and said "We haven't heard from you in like a year! " Hahhahah
The things he said around the ~26:50 mark were quite hilarious and valid as well.
Yeah that was pretty hilarious
I will leave my thoughts on this too:
I really like the idea of forming comittees. The only marketing we have right now is word-of-mouth, which obviously will be not successful if the Steem price is down. I have seen a dramatic decrease in posts over the last few weeks, mostly due to the bear market we a currently facing. It is unclear what the future holds for us, whether Steem will become a social media blockchain or will serve for blogging only. A really good initiative is Utopian.io - because it supports meaningful work in the open-source section. Another really good one is Steemstem, supporting science in every aspect. I think in the long run we should definitely form other initiatives for other topics f.ex. Sports, Health, Law, Astronomy, Travel, Lifehacks etc. This platforms are going to enhance the quality of the posts, because everyone tries to do his or her best in order to get a vote. This will inevitably draw more attention from outside to the blockchain. I think just a copy of Facebook or Twitter with a reward system won't be enough to draw the masses to our blockchain. We are going to need a big and vital community, with lots of talent and lots of knowledge in different fields. Knowledge which can only be found on the Steem Blockchain and no where else. We have to face the question, what our Unique Selling Proposition ('USP') really is.
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Thank you for this thoughtful, thorough and candid account/outline @aggroed. I’m sorry I missed the show — I was nose deep in SM book design — didn’t even remember it was Sunday. I’ll have to listen to the recording later. 🙌🏼 Thanks again for all you do. It’s clear that you sincerely care about this place. ⭐️
Could you please provide me with a link of the recording? I somehow missed the link in the original post.
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Here's the link to the YouTube video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dP2hMpzgGcQThe recording is at the very beginning of this post. Just press the ‘play’ button (arrow pointing right) in the center of the image. 😉
Alright I see what the issue was. On Partiko the YouTube Video didn't display. Thanks a lot guys! :)
Thank you @kenny-crane I wasn't able to get to it either.
@aggroed, this is a great post. Thanks for taking the time and energy in standing up for the community.
@ned, you are a visionary, but visionaries can't stand alone. The community is here to support and sustain you, but we can't do that if you're absent.
The Circa team is working on a community organization and project incubation tool could greatly assist in the creation of a decentralized council/committee network as discussed above. Our front-end tools and real-time dashboards will allow Steem users to create and set skills & abilities, adopt Steem #domains, and create Steem-based trust accounts that distributed earnings daily to all council/commitee members. Due to the absence of working SMTs, we are hoping to launch using custom @wavesplatform tokens. We are currently in development but have some of the most basic features working. We hope to have a public Alpha test later this week.
https://circa.systems
@Aggroaed, this is awesome step. I carefully went through this https://hackmd.io/EzrGbFQdQ0yGRtrx4lGQ3w?edit# and it made a great sense. It's a well thought out plan for Steem's leadership. However, here are my suggestions while we still hope for the Feb. 2 meet:
Glad to see our Fyrst in here, Ned came to SteemSpeak the other night and had a conversation. Glad he went on MSP too. Many people have been concerned and maybe this will ease some of their concerns.
@aggroed wants to be CEO while @ned plays guitar. At this point I'd be ok with that. Either that or he needs to do this sometimes and needs @juliekponsford or someone like her to be his community outreach.
I don't dislike @ned, but this conversation is 2 years too late. If he was doing this once or twice a month I'd have no issues with his as a frontman. I'd feel like at least we know what we are doing here, whether we agree or disagree. It's not only a matter of showing up, it's about dialogue and respect towards the community, not treating us like idiots, not sugar coating things, and not being unable to apologize when you mess up. No one cares about how well you play guitar when the platform is falling apart. Fix it and we'll all be happy to watch you play then.
This is by far the best post I have read in my 18 months on Steem. I learned so much from it and have now a better perspective to where we come from and where we should go. Please @ned, listen to Aggroed, who has earned himself a respect here on so many levels, very few others have achieved so far. If Steem wants to thrive, we have to communicate and work together. Let's enfold the real hivemind that is still slumbering here. We have proven before how quickly the community can come together to push Steem. Make use of that!
I agree, one of the best posts I've read...just shows how poor the steemit comm has been over the years laying out the true history and lay of the land on steem block chain.
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The lack of communication is the biggest insult, people can take bad news, but no news is just wrong
Hi, certainly the downturns in Steem creates distrust and many people go away because of ignorance, this type of conversations help us to understand a little more and to see the effort that some make so that this blockchain can be more reliable and grow.
Hi @aggroed, I'm @checky ! While checking the mentions made in this post I noticed that @disregardingfiat doesn't exist on Steem. Maybe you made a typo ?
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!help.How would we create an open governance? Would it be made up of all people or just the important stakeholders( not my opinion as we ARE ALL IMPORTANT) aka whales and top 20 witnesses? I am curious how you would move forward and what you see a governance.
Your efforts are appreciated man! Thanks for putting together the hackmd content and putting together the plan it entails.
I would remove the word "Committees" and replace it with "Community teams". Committees makes it sound like the worst of communism.
I do think development needs to be opened but the problem is how many groups are willing to fund the initiative to train and bring in new development teams? I would also like to see a research initiative. I mentioned for example VDF and randomness beacons as an idea for Steem but I notice there is a lack of discussion or organized community for research into these new technological opportunities.
As a result Steemit and SMTs are really the only concrete ideas on the table which has received popular discussion.
A large part of the reason those are the only ideas on the table is the closed development process and that those are the only ideas that have been promoted and pushed by Steemit, even though they have not been able to deliver on them to any significant degree.
This is a broken ecosystem, and some profound restructuring is needed as a precondition to make it work better before more, and better, work can actually get done. @aggroed is correct about that (as are you).
Agree re "Committees". The model that seems to work best in the cryptocurrency marketplace is a foundation to govern that the funds are managed responsibly and then developers are hired or given grants (on a project and/or ongoing basis) to do the work. It isn't committees or even teams that do the work, it is developers (and marketers, lawyers, etc. depending on the nature of the work that needs to be done). The foundation or what some are calling committees exist to oversee the thing and make sure that money isn't wasted or stolen.
I would like to see steemit.com run as a private for profit company with the intent of making it the best social site in the world, that just so happens to have one of the best cryptocurrencies attached to it.
Letting the steemit,inc team work on the steem blockchain and turning over steemit.com to a different team seems like the best approach to me.
And yes the selling of 800,000 steem per month has to stop.
This is a model that I think would actually work, though perhaps not the only one: Split off Steem (blockchain) from steemit (social web site) each with its own funding and governance. Steemit Inc the for profit company can build and run steemit.com as one of the apps backed by the Steem cryptocurrency and blockchain, and a community governance structure and/or foundation can develop the code for the Steem blockchain.
I'm not sold on the idea of Steemit Inc developing the blockchain. Blockchains are inherently a community resource and a private unaccountable company developing them is always a bit of a strain. It can probably work with an excellent team and excellent management with the right vision and approach but that doesn't seem to be the case here and I see no reason to expect that to change in the future (beyond wishful thinking, which I reject as a plan).
I could get on board with this as well. My main goal was just that I would like to see them separated. I also would like to see them follow through with implementing some advertising and then maybe a revenue sharing model or some gamification of some kind to provide alternative revenue streams for users.
Agreed, talk about shooting ourself in the foot.
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I guess I would STRONGLY advocate for an additional Committee:
Call it what you will but, essentially: The People's Committee.
The committee for issues within the community. Similar in roles and governance, to the other committees mentioned, however, it would ultimately, have someone serving that would in essence serve as an employee of the PEOPLE, to bring the voice of the people back to the governance of the Blockchain. A Steemit Ombudsmen.
In essence, the committee charter would be retention, and steemian issues.
Thanks for writing the post and explaining about the background (ninja mine) and the catalyst (Hardfork 21 "Freedom")...
More people here on Steem should be aware of these "issues" in order to find a sustainable future for the whole community, not only for the witnesses and the visionary "leader".
Too bad the host was talking 90% of the time, and we could not hear more from the person in question.
The visions expressed by the "leader" on this show did not inspire me at all. On the other hand, the resent drama got the community together and amazing projects are in the making.
Its time to let the community take the lead, why do we have to wait for one person to act?
Maybe a hardfork is a positive way to leave the dark past behind and move to a brighter future of Steem.
This will be interesting.
Maybe now someone comes to help with the development?
I was expecting this from Utopian, but just quietness from that corner.
Maybe those tokens will lure them in.
Or prospect of committees
Now steem enters the phase of communism.
In its original definition :)
That was excellent @aggroed and @ned. You guys actually brought tears to my eyes a time or two and made me feel more hopeful than I have felt in months.Thank you.
when you know all the facts steem is 100% a security,
since one entity from the offset controlled a significant amount of the distribution of rewards and set about farming in the millions of SP for various steemit inc accounts whilst also controlling changes to system reward mechanisms etc
This townhall was EXTREMELY necessary. I would like to thank @ned for taking the time.
Missed the show yesterday... managed to catch up today and I'm really glad I did. Thanks for sharing this recording.
A well explained article. I got to know so many things from this article. I also would like to say that you have asked things in a nice way. Hoping to see some fruit from this.
Even I strongly believe in this chain and not really happy by the way it is progressing.
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Well done. Thank you!
Litening to this recording why the hell don'e we make @Aggroed CEO and @ned the Chairman/Founder,
@ned just keeps skirting around the issues that #aggroed keeps asking him. He just is not on the ball as far as Communications in way a CEO should be. Not all.
Not even close. I know I had my issues with @aggroed in the past. Personal stuff which to be honest was just kind of silly on my part. But the more I listen to him he sounds like a CEO who is able to Communicate effectively.
Am I wrong ??
You continue to earn your witness vote over and over again, thank you for keeping it real! There's literally no words to be added here, I wish Ned would take some example from you. Bravo!
I can't say if doing a coup d'etat against steemitinc will do good to the steem economy because if they can do it to the major stake holders what more for little ones.
Hi @aggroed, thanks for the historical insights and for pushing forward the need for concrete plans.
BTW Feb 2nd is a Saturday (not a Sunday); you may wish to edit either the day or date. I hope it is the Saturday so can participate, as in Asia will be the dead of night.
My own work and interest is in the economic system that Steem has created. This could be a sub-committee of the blockchain committee but it needs the skills and insights of mathematicians, economists, game theorists, systems analysts etc before looking at the encoding.
The field of cryptoeconomics is new and faces genuine challenges in creating autonomous systems that can adapt to human behaviour without either crashing or heading towards some unwanted attractor. Nobody has as yet created such a blockchain economy, hence it is worth doing.
We have seen that hard forks that affect the economic code can have dramatic effects on the system, hence any changes must not be taken lightly or without thorough testing. What is needed is a few people who truly understand how the Steem economic system works plus some new blood from the areas mentioned above.
The Steem blockchain is agnostic to human qualities and value judgments; it merely reacts to blockchain actions. I can see the current drive is to add a human layer above the pure coin flow, with the development of new websites and communities. However, there also needs to be a long hard look at the coin creation and distribution so that the steem macroeconomics actually facilitates the microeconomics of both the individual members and communities.
I ❤️ Steemit!
Seriously, to have seen it grow, in both bull and bearish runs has been an honor!
Thank you @aggroed, @frystikken, and @llfarms for doing this. I'm not sure if there was an agenda for Ned available before the show (perhaps not possible if he joined last min), but that could help him with his prep to not skate around some stuff we're keen on, which may not be so important to him.
Hey Matt! No, there was no agenda or questions lined up. He just happened to show up in audience and we invite anyone from the audience to come on air, which he chose to do. I think having his own scheduled forum would probably be most likely planned before hand and allow him to be a bit more specific and direct with answers etc. Or maybe he just didn’t want to give too much info 🤷🏻♀️ Who knows. But yes it was all very impromptu and no questions were known before hand. Glad he took the opportunity to chat and hope it happens more often as well as getting a bit more into the hard questions in a respectful way as well.
Thanks for the quick response and taking the time to spell this out.
Watching now!
Thank you so much for this. 💪👍
Worth for reading and Sharing. Many would have curious to know about steem and more importantly about. @ned showed up...resteemed👍
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Indeed, just to disappear without any explanation ... would you behave like that when you had an appointment with a friend or a business partner? Just unthinkable!
Even no other person from the whole Steemit Inc. stuff provided any further information.
Exactly: all the new already existing and planned DApps are really great, but we shouldn't forget that we already had (and still have) a unique feature which differentiates us from all other crypto currencies and blockchains: a functioning community, a social network that gives even non-crypto affine persons the possibility to enter a until now for them completely new world. We should make onboarding as easy and simple as possible and care much more about new users than we currently do. The value of other successful social media sites like facebook is not because of any superior technology but because of the huge and (more or less) satisfied user base!