I am pleased to receive your comment and I welcome it.

Where Plato got his insights from, is a mystery some people wonder about. I'm not entirely sure, although I would guess that at some point he realized it. I could link it, perhaps superficially, to the fact that he learned of Socrates' fate after trying to change people. But I wouldn't be sure about that either.

But where no one observes each other, correction can hardly take place. Wisdom does not come out of nowhere, it is often only achieved when one realises one's own error. But how can you realise that you are mistaken?

I think that after a while one realizes one's own mistakes. For example, one will realize the consequences of one's actions in the long run. Even if I tell someone what's right and what's wrong, that person may not pay attention to me until their own experiences make them realize it. How many times have we heard someone tell us something, only to pay no attention to it and ignore it, and finally, after many experiences, realize that they were right? This happens all the time, in my opinion. I talked about it in a post I made a few months ago.

As a person born into a family, you will have those who exemplify virtue, but you will also have those who do not. Those who can give eloquent reasons for every vice will find their way to the individual just as much as those who refrain from doing so. How do you know one from the other?

The first thing is that the one who practices virtue, as in the example given, is not trying to change others. He is accepting others. This makes his example stronger, I think. One may have faith that other people will realize it, just as one realized it.

Moreover, much of what we usually call "arguments" are really justifications. People are usually for or against something, and then justify it with "arguments". It's not the arguments that convince them, it's just a way of masking a decision they've already made with rationality.

So the young man may listen to these arguments, and however rational they may seem, these arguments can only fool the mind, and just for a while. In the end, it is up to the young person to decide what to do. What he feels is right and what sounds real to him. It is not even a conscious or rational decision at this point, but more subtle.

Furthermore, I think that, by example alone, we are naturally attracted to people who lead more virtuous lives. Why? Because virtue, I think, brings better outcomes. Practicing virtue is harder because we don't see the immediate and short-term results, but when we see someone doing it, we really see its fruits. We came to have a tangible proof of it. That's why example can be so powerful.

And I think, if you put the two people face to face, the contrast will be so obvious that one will intuitively know which way to go.

Does a young man who indulges in vices automatically become a virtuous person simply because he has a single male role model who instils confidence through his strong presence and non-interference? I don't rule that out, but I would call it rather the exception to the rule. The given story is from my point of view an exaggeration to get a point across.

Yes, the story may be an exaggeration, after all, we are not sure if it is completely real. Although, nonetheless, can serve as an anecdote I think. I would say, the influence of the "virtuous" person will depend on how "virtuous" that person is. The more exceptionally "good" he is, the greater the impact he will have upon others.

If he is in doubt and needs to reflect on what and how he intends to do something, who does he turn to in the final instance? Does he accept that his authority is ultimately only on loan? How can he have humility when he is the one whose word counts?

If he is truly practicing virtue, I expect he will know how to recognize when he needs the help of others. And we probably all have struggles, and if we have a little bit of wisdom we can realize, at least in my opinion, that humility is not something we choose to believe, but a reality that we come to accept.

Yes, I suppose his nephew was exposed to his uncle's thinking because Plato was a very famous and respected philosopher at the time.

A young man who has attitudes and fluff in his head needs a strong challenge, he has to experience boundaries. If he is not given one, he will not find the necessary virtue. He needs strong role models who serve as challengers by confronting him with the consequences of his capers.

Each young person is different and I could not give a general rule. I think it would take discernment to know what and to what extent to do. But at the same time I think he should have the freedom to make his own mistakes and learn from them. Again, it depends on each individual case.

It is possible to teach someone who gains insight by observing their role model, but presumably only if there was already something in that person that made it possible.

I could agree with it, and this would be true for both the good and the bad.

Again, I truly appreciate your comment. Many thanks to you!