Editing and taking a different approach here.
THE ABUSE HERE ON STEEMIT IS RAMPANT AND THERE IS LITTLE TO NO PUBLIC DISCUSSION ON ADDRESSING THIS ISSUE.
@ned, WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO TO ADDRESS THE VOTING ABUSE ON THIS BLOCKCHAIN? THE FACT THAT USERS HAVE TO WASTE VOTING POWER TO CURB ABUSE IS NOT THE RIGHT APPROACH AND IS NOT WORKING. MANY IMPROVEMENTS HAVE BEEN SUGGESTED BY THE COMMUNITY, PLEASE MAKE THIS A PRIORITY.
WHALES, WHEN ARE YOU GOING TO STEP UP AND PROTECT YOUR STAKE/INVESTMENT? (Easy answer, I know, when it doesn't take away from your potential to earn)
Take a look at this user who is currently receiving over 6% of the reward pool. DOES A SINGLE USER DESERVE THIS MUCH FOR ANYTHING?!
It's not 6%, that's off by a decimal place @berniesanders. (Real value is 0.6%) Not sure why steem.supply displays it as such, but if you check another service, such as steemworld.org, you will see the correct value, which is 0.6% (of course, that is still a rather large chunk! I'm a stickler for details, though :P)
Edit: I just did ran the "Coming Author Rewards" feature on Steemworld for @haejin, and it calculated it at 1% of the rewards pool. (As I stated, this is still quite large!)
Note: this comment is meant to be neutral and focus on getting the facts straight. I support each stakeholder's right to vote as they see fit. I am intrigued by this mysterious whale @ranchorelaxo that has appeared seemingly out of nowhere as well. Has anyone investigated this in detail?
Upvoting this comment for visibility and to counter the hysteria caused by the erroneous 6% figure.
I do want to also mention that I have been reading @haejin's blog since he was making only $5 a post before he went viral, and more importantly, watching his videos which is where the most substantial aspect of his added value to the Steemit/cryptocurrency community comes in. Though the posts are quite brief and could be construed to be somewhat vague (as lampooned by @netuoso) the videos are often up to 30 minutes and go into great detail on Eliot wave analysis and chart pattern recognition (something he has been practicing for over 15 years.) He has a lot of YouTube followers and they make Steemit accounts just to comment on his analysis, which is partly why he has so many followers on Steemit.
I am aware that some believe that technical analysis is total bunk, and not surprisingly, they are generally the ones who are not themselves trained in the art. As plenty of others have stated, part of @haejin's recent success is due to the fact that he has correctly anticipated quite a few movements in cryptocurrencies, which has caused many of his followers to become rather wealthy. Therefore, the firepower to upvote him increases more rapidly than other bloggers.
Again, I support anyone's right to upvote as well as downvote as they see fit, but I just wanted to weigh in from the perspective of someone who has benefited in the past from his tutorials, general knowledge, and more specific recommendations. I also wanted to make sure that the correct figure for the potential rewards was displayed, as it is currently inaccurate on steem.supply.
I want to also mention that I respect your approach to correcting the rewards pool distribution because I know there is zero financial incentive to do so. You and @transisto are some of the few that seem willing to counter abuse by sacrificing monetary gain and I appreciate that. I admired the transparency when you were posting on @yougotflagged as well.
My apologies for this mini-essay and the self-voting, but I want to further the discussion here. Trying to see both sides to the best of my ability. Peace.
I'm sure someone has already answered this, but this is what I gather from my own investigation.
-rancho showed up here about 10 months ago and laid mostly dormant.
-7 months ago started buying massive amounts of steem
-@ned reached out to him around this time asking him to "ping" him on steemit.chat
-2 months later, @theprophet0 reached out again asking him to ping him on Steemit.chat
-15 days ago, he started upvoting @haejin's posts eventually to the tune of 10,775.09
-he also upvoted himself 3 times for like $1000.
-he also upvoted one other person for $10.
-Note the numbers above changed during my analysis (going lower) I'm not sur if that was due to downvotes or changes in the price of steem. I was using steemit more info chrome plugin for the data.
-@haejin reached out to rancho when the upvotes started with the following: "I am very grateful for your upVote! Thank You! If you'd like a crypto analyzed, please don't hesitate to let me know!"
-@Ranchorelaxo has no other interactions that I saw other than a single comment ("great post") on a post that he didn't upvote.
Other findings
-@haejin's content seems legit
-he was very successful and had many followers long before rancho came around
-many of his supporters seem to have came here for him or because of him
-many of his supporters have no idea who rancho is (or that he was giving haejin 11k in upvote) and think this campaign is about his success due to their upvotes.
-@haejin doesn't seem to mention @ranchorelaxo by name to his followers.
That last one may not be true, but I haven't seen it...but he has a lot of posts and I haven't gone through all of them. I'm upvoting this for visibility. Please don't downvote me. If I got something wrong, I'll change it, but this is my account from what I have seen so far and according to my notes and recollection, but I am tired as fuck. So I may have gotten something wrong.
@berniesanders Please correct yourself.
So this is telling: @berniesanders read my comment, as well as the comment above. And, instead of clarifying the situation, he simply flagged it down. I don't need to know more on this.
Is bernie sipping on the haterade?? Lol
https://steemit.com/berniesanders/@truejordan/berniesanders-claims-haejin-is-raping-the-reward-pool-is-he-sipping-the-haterade-20171223t01335884z
agreeable and fair comment.upvoted
I also support you,a fair comment!!!
@berniesanders is profiting from attacking other people. Every comment he makes he gets money. Every post now that he makes, he makes insane amounts of money. $1,000???? His other posts get nowhere near that! He is just trying to profit. He also has the same few people following him around upvoting every comment. And then he downvotes everything someone says about him and his same 50-60 upvoters then come and downvote you. I’m not saying haejin deserves all of his rewards, but at least he is providing us with something useful while Bernie simply profits off of attacking haejin and everyone else who opposes Ernie. Watch, i will probably be downvoted by his group. @haejin provides us with analysis that has earned us money. He teaches us about the technical analysis. He allows for us to comment with our own analysis and he will help us improve it to be more accurate. He does 1-on-1 lessons. What does @berniesanders do? Not as much as @haejin in terms of providing useful content.
waht goes around comes around, If Steemit had moderators it would be Bernie that would be barred. And all his steem power taken off him, that may be the pay back...lol
Very true
haejin does a good job, i've recommended him to many friends.
he's just doing what steemit community is supposed to do:
providing good content.
while others are cheating with bots and stuff...
i hope hate speech wont become the new trend here.
thank you! this BernieSanders and his gang of flaggers have been profiting by promoting censorship and suppression of free will on the blockchain, we must all unite against them so they do not get away with it
Nice comment : )
thank you, I am glad I was not the only one noticing this pattern
This comment should be higher up.
He using techniques like ------ as I don't know the theory name but I will explain the theory in a brief manner. Now here it goes. It works great when you already have lots of followers. Suppose you have 5000 followers, you said half of them that market is going to go down and another half the vice versa. Now you got nothing loose. Now suppose the market falls down, so the 50% followers says he was right and remaining another half you repeat this loop . In between this new followers will be added as word of mouth etc. And he made them join the loop. So this is going to be run infinite times. Till it exhausted.
Uh... Only he can't split the message like that... He's publicly and veritably either right or wrong. What you describe is an age old scam, and is 100% not what Haejin does.
slapbox@ I should I have similar instead of like. People who earn money like that never show their true face to the public. And I don't know Haejin personally neither did you. So please don't reply to this post.
If I write technical analysis i treat it like weather report. It must hold to great extend. Better is your prediction and more constant, better are your skills. I'm still minnow and I have to enforce myself but I always encourage my readers to check my previous analyses to check that they holds.
Try and check here, I be glad to hear your opinion and comments.
@haejin had established itself here on steemit also. He have knowledge and I respect that most. What he had done whit his earnings is not a nice theme to comment. I always recommending minding your own businesses.
Interesting opinion thanks. It was fair. I can see that complaining on a new whale will cause monetary gain as well. hmmmm still worth reading
the things you do for money...
But can't we downvote, ignore, mute, unfollow and report as spam to proactively deal with this issue?
I'm new to Steem and made my #introduceyourself only a few hours ago as my first post. Was surprised to see a few people commenting, following and request that I follow and upvote them back. Have a look at their profiles and it's a mish-mash of spam, apparent botnetting and other such dubious practices.
As i'm so new, i'd love to see a guide as to how we can all proactively quash such practices using whatever processes we have at our disposal on this platform.
oh my gut
Agreed
I am a grateful newbie, and would greatly appreciate any guidance on how I may better be an effective curator, on this marvelous platform.
Best thing to do is not get caught up in this drama. The developers and witnesses will get things figured out about how to get this place running optimally, eventually. Keep your head down till then.
a good advice to newbies
Best advice I've seen 😬
@haejin is so popular because he provides FREE cryptocurrency analysis and training to everyone in the community. He absolutely deserves all the upvotes that he gets! He gets 6% based on merit and based on providing content that the community finds valuable! This is exactly what blockchain and decentralization is about - WE the users decide what we find valuable and those are the ones that rise. Keep up the amazing work @haejin and don't let bullies deter you!
This post got a thousand dollars. great content apparently...
really glad to read your explanation on this issue. Thanks.
what's wrong if the person work hard and deserved what he earn, isn't steemit about that ? anyone can take the place of this guy or can earn much better if he do his best, why a lot of people are angry about that, keep calm, work hard, post everyday, record good video and share them and you will be like him or even better.
It is nothing about "we" and all about "you". The art of dealing with comments on your blog is a personal decision you do not make "once for all". It is up to your mood, your generosity to overlook bad behavior or to try to correct it. If you are having a good flow, get nice and supportive or in a good way challenging comments than some spamming comments won't bother you. If you for some reason are disturbed you'll react on how you feel in that second. In my view there is no "general treatment" but only a reaction you want yourself to be visible (or not).
Sometimes you care, sometimes not. If you would bind yourself to a certain strict way of dealing you'll lose easiness. That is how I see it.
hey @berniesanders go flag meeee https://steemit.com/trending/@parisienne/haejin-vs-berniesanders-first-impressions
What @haejin does by looking at charts to predict prices is called 'chartism' and it's not without its criticisms with some experts calling it 'a form of financial astrology'. Chartism is guided by the philosophy of "history repeats itself" which is never a safe bet in mature markets. Most all crypto currency has gone up and almost anyone invested has made money whether they follow @haejin advice or not.
Maybe @haejin doesn't deserve so many followers because we think he has low-quality posts but he seems to be going about his posting honestly. Hopefully any changes to Steemit would encourage higher quality posts more than punishing lower quality posts.
I am agreed it is really appreciable
Nice write-up and also a nifty steemworld.org link there. I'm off fiddling with it for a while now :P
vote up
Thanks - this comment helped me understand the rage going on between these two and their followers!
Nice
You have collected your daily Power Ups! Your posts received total upvotes worth of 13.37$.
Learn how to power up smart here!
I totally agree with you, this all sounds ignorant..if 1 source says 1 thing and another says the opposite, then forsure there is something wrong here.
Do you have a link to steemworld?
I'd like to see that tool.
Bernie, flag this shit from russian propagandist called as clarityofsignal!
I appreciate you trying to see both sides. Do you mind correcting your incorrect statement which says “ zero financial incentive to do so”?
If you look at his post he makes a lot of money through up votes by slandering other people and attacking them.
I hope you correct that statement because there are many new users who may believe you. 🤗
If you agree that psychology isn't completely random and/or agree that self-fulfilling prophecy, by way of a sufficient volume of people basing their investment decisions on a similar belief (in this case: price pattern or "signal"), is something that can, and sometimes does happen, then you can't completely reject the claim that there is real value in analyzing chart patterns.
Hardly anything in this world is black or white, as much as the purely rational minded would prefer it not to be so. Regarding empirical based knowledge, at best, we can rate things (hypothesis or what-have-you) along a "spectrum of proof" and nothing has ever, or will ever, hit either extreme (if only because we can't prove that we even exist in the first place).
You're painting technical analysis (TA) as if it's pure black (provably bogus), but, statistically speaking, there ARE relatively strong correlations within the practice of TA that demonstrate statistical significance in predicting future price performance (compared to randomly assigning a guess as to whether price will move up or down), so, if anything, it's more on the white side of the spectrum, if not high up that spectrum.
i often check heajin posts and astrology charts.
both are accurate.
It's clear to me that you're either biased or ignorant on this topic.
At first glance, TA might look like a lot of attempts at practicing voodoo on price or simply letting one's own inner child out to play around with crayons on a price chart, but I assure you there's ample data to prove to a high degree of certainty (as the sample pool is rather large at this point in time) that it's not all bogus.
There are favorable odds attached to trading certain re-occurring patterns within the markets (eg "ascending triangles", "falling wedges", etc), when using their traditional trading rules. They only work out to somewhere between 55 and 60% favorable, but that is actually quite significant when compared to simply tossing a coin and choosing whether to take a trade or not based on the outcome.
Theories as to why these patterns play out? They're abound. It seems reasonable to me that human psychology isn't completely random. Assuming that's true, humans can't react randomly to price -- there should be at least a little bit of predictability in how each individual and, therefore, the market, reacts to any given set of circumstances. If that's true, then real patterns will play out based on their reactions. That's what we see when we analyze price charts.
You're a funny guy @introvertspeaks, but you're a lousy troll ;)
I guess it comes down to one simple concept here: you have one opinion, I another.
Best of luck to you.
I don't see any problem with Bernies upvoted comments or trending posts regarding the reward pool, because he uses his rewards mostly for countering highly paid bs posts. With that in mind, he is doing a wonderful job for the whole steem world. And as he stated, he paid a huge amount of SBD for getting the attention of other whales.
We all should try to see the whole picture. Maybe Haejin is a good technical analyst, but why should an account of an already well paid man take a huge part of the rewards out of the pool, which actually is intended to be for all of us? Should the minnows really deserve less rewards, because of the good work of one person?
The incorrectly calculated percentage of 6% on steem.supply brought me to implementing it to the steemworld so that we can see the real values from now on. I'm thinking about adding some kind of "reward pool rape index" at the top for each account so that we are able to detect such cases in an easier way.
But I think the 1% makes no difference, because it tells us the same story. Someone takes a huge amount of the available rewards by creating many posts on a daily basis. This fact shows me that it can't have taken so much time to create them. Some of us work for days or even weeks for making one post that then ends in a $100 payout. Maybe we really need kind of a post limit again...
Anyway, great job @berniesanders! As soon as I find time for it, I will add some "extras" in my tool for better detecting this kind of accounts in the future ;)
This looks really odd to me (all from the top of the trending page):
As I have seen in his youtube videos, he uses my tools, but I have never received an upvote from him. Why, when he begs for upvotes at the end of each video with the reason that hard work should deserve votes?
My german post for introducing my new tool (steemworld) is at $192 and it took me months to develope it. I'm not complaining about my rewards but I think it's an interesting comparison...
Same here dude, working hard on developing tools for Steem and im lucky that i have the backing of a couple of people who have some contacts. Still, im only getting in the range of tens of dollars per post for stuff that im spending hours working on.
"reward pool rape index"
I am begging for this index to be published - please make it available immediately. This is a project for utopianio.
I'm in awe of the idea that a heavy hitter with fans would be treated like this.
"Let's kill him." says steemit.
This place is a never ending amusement park of insanity. Now that you have all played with the big kids today, please go comment on 3 posts of authors between 35-45 rep. You do not even have to upvote them. Just make a comment so they don't think they are posting into a black hole.
This small, generous action on your part will improve the place more than anything else you can do today.
Remember that we get less than 3 comments per post and so many are very lonely. Comment to little guys daily, and we might have less than 97% of them die off right when things are getting good.
Such index would be nice to have, but its calculation should be very well thought through. A percentage alone can not tell the whole story for all people. As you've mentioned, the possibility exists that it's a rich person who brought a super huge stake. I don't want to kill famous people on steemit just because they are famous, but the fame should be shared within the whole steem world and it may be difficult to take care of it without manual work...
"Let's adjust the rewards a bit" would sound better to me.
"Some of us work for days or even weeks for making one post that then ends in a $100 payout." If only time spent creating a product actually mattered to the end user.
Yeah, I always laugh deeply when I see his wonderful comments. He's one of the best comedians that we have here... ^^ Maybe we should make a "Best of Bernies Wordings" compilation :)
He may sound a bit rough for some people, but in most cases there is really a truth to discover in his words...
There is an entire article about this topic that lays out the points form both camps here https://steemit.com/steem/@pawsdog/the-reward-pool-rape-saga-between-berniesanders-and-haejin give it a read, it may be a good place for the adults to talk without all the mudslinging and other silliness.
If I upvote this does it mean I agree with bernie on this screen cast, cause there is a lot of shilling going on
Most of the money for this post were all paid for by Bernie him self, it COST him a lot to make this post and he made it to bring attention to something.
We can all agree or disagree and that is our right/choice, yet he did NOT make the money on this post, he paid for it to bring attention to something he felt was important.
Well agree or disagree as I said he put up the money and is not making money on the post. Also this is not reddit its Steemit so only makes sense to bring exposure to the platform in question.
There are plenty of things that happen here that I disagree with but that doesnt mean that they are morons because I disagree.
I also dont feel that calling people names even if they do something distasteful helps anything either.
who is this bully? BERNIE. Steemit need content to help get more people to see it and want to get on board. BERNIE you are adding Zero to Steemit.
IT'S YOU THAT SHOULD GO.
bla bla
agree with you
that is not how bots work, mate...
I find it extremely interesting the people trying to defend haejin on this post. I am wondering how many of them are the bot army that Haejin has created.
Will look into this more after work when I can actually spend time on it.
😂😂😂😂
I clicked a few profiles and must admit I happened on a few that seemed eerily empty.
Feel free to investigate my profile though! Maybe you'll like what you see and I'll gain a follower out of you 😉
Haejin brought a bunch of people to steemit who followed him on youtube and twitter. They are new and mostly here to follow him. There is nothing wrong with that.
I looked you up when I originally posted on your first comment. I am pretty positive, (from a glance), that you are a legitimate user. steemdb.com can help figure that out though by votes and who votes you and such.
With these issues, it seems as if we need some sort of tool that connect accounts to each other and almost create webs of connections.
A. Would be interesting to see from a community standpoint.
B. Would make finding his shill accounts easier.
I know there's a bunch of decentralized AI projects going on. I've always wondered what specifically they could be used for.. but maybe those projects are capable of scanning the entire blockchain and finding correlations? It's all beyond my comprehension, but maybe you or other smart people can figure it out.
How do you know what "we" all need?
I literally signed up on steemit so that i could upvote haejin. If u read his comments section. There are at least 5 people every post of haejins saying they did the same thing. I joined steemit from his twitter, didnt need steemit account wotsoeva
You have taken quite a time to call names and claim people are bots. Just go to google trends and check "haejin" or "Haejin Steemit". Why is it so hard for you to understand that there are tons of people that are flocking here from twitter and youtube just to follow his posts. And some of those people will become a functional and contributing member of this ecosystem, which will help all of you guys. Personally I have been indecisive about buying steem and being a permanent participant. At the end, thanks to the relentless nonsense I have seen here in the couple of days I hated this obnoxious atmosphere and have lost all interest.
He picks random coins and says they will go up hundreds or percent. All of them have the same growth prediction pattern and no research is done on any of the development of the coins. If you look at his success rate for predictions, you'll see it's way less than 50% meaning anybody could have done the same guessing and came up with similar results for predictions.
You are right. It is rubbish.
But the fact is that there are many many MANY other that basically do the same.
I've seen users getting daily $100+ rewards for literaly saying the price of couple of coins every few hours.
No added value.
But then again, maybe that's just it. People are stupid we vote stupid things.
After all, most traffic on the Internet is not society-changing whitepapers about crypto, but rather cat videos and porn.
Meet humanity.
But what would we do if there was no porn or cat videos?
Just stop following these people.... if you want to get suckered into this garbage then be my guest.
But i agree. Better no garbage....
I feel the subject matter here shouldn't be attacked. He is doing what he knows how to do Best. Anyone could as well so the same !! it's so fine, what he he has been doing only catches the interest of a lot of people that is why he gets the upvotes.
He is filling up a Gap, many would snub any day.
I can guarantee you that even if you are 100% correct about something, calling the people you're talking to 'MINDLESS SHEEP' will not win you any support or sympathy. <3
Do you have any data to back up that claim? I have stacks of $ that say his hit rate is well above 50%.
To be fair, if you made literally any position in any coin in the crypto market the past months, you would have made money. While I appreciate @Haejin's work, it doesn't take knowledge in TA to succeed in crypto - whether that's a good or bad thing.
You are quite right, I would have made money either way, I would have made less on my own though, of that I have no doubt whatsoever.
If you work out the actual math, find out if your investments did better than you would have by buying in at the same dollar amount in all cryptos and waiting. I promise you, that method has never been beaten in the long run and the advisor you're listening to is only trying to boost his own personal investment - the one before your own. He's using you.
I am absolutely certain, it's not just a case of "oh @haejin says this coin will go up" and I bought it, I think I've done that once. I held when I otherwise would have sold, and I sold and moved positions into different coins on more than one occasion. Is it just that he influenced me to not be dumb? Maybe but nonetheless the information was valuable to me.
That is a bit beside the point in the context of my original response though. If it's so easy to make money in this market, how can his hit rate possibly be less than 50%? That truly would require skill. @ponts won't provide that data because it doesn't exist.
Here, (https://www.investopedia.com/university/advancedwave/) go educate yourself about the method he claims he have 15+ years of experience.
BTW, the best analyst on the financial market ever existed only had 68% of accuracy.
Make sure to read through all of it, and make your own conclusions.
you are right taking.........also right....................
l support you.............
I couldn't agree more, I actually just wrote a post about this exact idea - Crypto is working for everyone in it (for the most part), what's stopping other people from joining? How can we improve crypto literacy?
With a fast rise in the value of bitcoin, i think many people have got attracted towards it. Since bitcoin value increased from 100$ a few years ago to some where around 20000$ right now, I think many people are hoping the same with other currencies as well. Thus are buying anything that is cheap. This in return giving success to every crypto currency even if it was dead for a long time.
Do you want someone to hold your hand and walk you through his posts!? Literally anyone can look at his blog and come to the same conclusions. I'm not saying that the coins he picked haven't gone up in value. I'm saying that his predictions are purely made up, and that he is wrong more than half the time.
It's not me that needs the hand holding, I read almost all of his posts and watch the videos, and have done so for quite some time.
Again do you have data to back your 50% claim? Saying it more than once doesn't add credibility.
what thanks.
This is absolutely not true. It is very easy to check how many times he has picked the coins that go up the most. I think only a blind man will deny Haejin's skills, but whatever. I choose to follow him, you don't and that's fine. I only can't understand the reason for jealous posts like the one from berniesanders - nobody forced me or any of the Haejin's followers to upvote him - we are just being thankful for what he does.
Absolutely.. He is taking steps a whole lot of people out there won't find a substantial reason taking.
Crypto literacy will improve exponentially as people lose money. Literacy will happen through experience.
Thanks for the information. I was looking into his stuff and couldn't really wrap my head around it. That said, a few people seemed to have made tons of money using his methods.
He uses, elliott wave. It's a bit complicated but it's a great way to analyse stocks or crypto's. I use it too. But he does it with random coins...
Please, educate yourself a bit here (https://www.investopedia.com/university/advancedwave/)
Yes most people who learned how this thing work are cashing out by the second!
TIAB
Its so frustrating. I joined steemit as a photographer with the hope that quality content might rise to the top. I guess all platforms are subject to abuse but it does make it frustrating.
Sounds like the typical trader. Not being able to outperform the market or in this case Bitcoin.
oh my gut
Let me drop my comment here - so it'll have the chance of getting a wider reach.
I'm neutral right here and I'm not supporting anybody, but lemme just speak my mind.
For me, anytime I see a post calling for the Flagging of another person's post, it just speaks:
Centralization
and
Censorship
to me, which I tought we were all against.
It's my opinion tho.
Peace
You are very right
JAJAJAAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJA
Fuck off kela
Most of his coins that he uses for his blog are community request. Someone ask for TA on the coin and he obliges. Not his fault some people are in coins that are perceived as shit coins. He is obliging what is asked of him. The coins that, if you read majority of his blogs, he believes in are excelling greatly and are of a 90% success rate.
For anyone to make any contributions it's worth whatever those voting says it's worth. Isn't that the whole essence of decentralization.
People voted his contents and Bots so i do not see any reason to castigate the man. We do so many thing for different reasons, most times for same reasons but our approach differ hence the variety of life.
Thank you @ponts
This is an interesting community here, i realized that reading this post. As it is very clear that, where there is politics there is good reading and laughter. This is my first ever comment by the way, had to start somewhere. Looking forward meeting many of you.
I agree with you
@ponts To me it doesn't even matter whether his predictions are right and precise or not. This is not even the point. We need to underline the need for limits to be put in place in order to prevent a single user from being able to gather such a large percentage of the rewards pool. If a single user is allowed to gather that much power, what happens when they decide to cash out one day?
Right.
Who decides on the limits? How does that work when 98% of STEEM is owned by less than 1% of the accounts.
STEEM is much like Venezuela. If you are part of the in crowd you can do OK, if you are not in favor of the "current government", you are going to get steemrolled.
Sorry for the mixed metaphor.
Indeed. I love the idea of steem but the ninja mine may have doomed it from the start.
Yes, but i think you are addressing the wrong point here.
The problem is not his content. Shit authors will always have his followers (Twilight anyone?), but the issue here is the system abuse. Check the first bernie post about this, and some facts posted there.
It's clear who the "kiddie" is here. An actual threat of violence, really? You have the dubious honor of being the first person to ever receive a flag from me.
@miltrado Nobody doubted the importance and value of his content, however the steem community's best interests aren't served by allowing a single user the ability to achieve such a percentage of the rewards pool. What if they decide to cash out one day? The reward pool is about building the platform, not allowing a single user the ability to destroy it.
In other words, limits have to be put in place. Otherwise the future of Steem is at stake. This whole thing makes the idea of the platform look farcical.
Highest Regards
@lordneroo
Is that @haejin fault? haha ... maybe steem needs to update their software, instead of taking pitchforks and torches to his place
@overcome I never said it was his fault, I have great admiration for the guy not only because he is educated and approaches the matter scientifically, but also because he offers his knowledge for free.
We are actually discussing in order to figure out what's best for our favourite platform's future. We're not here to judge or blame anybody. It doesn't even matter whose fault it is to me.
My initial comment raised some serious points concerning the platform's future. I would appreciate your input concerning those vital points as well. I'm a fan of @haejin as well. This doesn't mean I would agree with him gathering 0,6% of the rewards pool.
Highest Regards
@lordneroo
If STEEM is the best idea you have, on ways to make money in crytpo market, you need to do a lot more research. The steemit.com site has some information that could be useful to you in the regard
@mitrado I do not approve of flagging anything unless it's plagiarism. I believe in freedom of speech. Therefore, I wouldn't agree with kicking out anybody either.
Concerning your investments, only thing I would advise you is to trust your personal instinct and gut feeling.
Best of luck!
other side of the coin!
I'm pretty sure an update would just make things more complicated for newbies
How is he not building the platform? I looked at a couple of his post and he has over 6,000 views, lowest comment cout I saw was 398, highest was 800+, so he either brought a shit load of people over to steemit, or thousands of people find his information useful. I myself do not care how much a person makes if they are making from generic votes from the users and not buying votes or doing a lot of self upvoting. Look at bernies page and the amount of "Reward Pool" rescue post he has made and how much "Money" he has taken from the Reward Pool. he is not making these post for altruistic reasons, if he did he would "decline" payout on all of them. He makes these post for one reason and one reason only- they make HIM MONEY. And I actually no longer have a problem with that, I did initially, but people like his content and vote it just like people like the subject of this post content and vote to give him money.
Merry Christmas
shoulda made a system that didnt have that flawwwwwwwww!!!!!
Gosh, I sure hope the price can hold if you cash that out.
Here is my point of view for consideration.
Those who are consuming his trading advice can upvote him. He will be motivated to have followers that are powering up and that are good for the Steem economy.
Not everyone cares about trading advice and $600k a month is a bit much for the reward pool to sustain at this time.
I hope he stays and I hope you all get rich with his trading tips and if he requires that much money to motivate him maybe you all can tip him for his advice.
In the meantime, those of us in Steem for the long haul will try to protect some of the reward pool. It isn't personal.
All posts are open for 7 days, for both upvotes and downvotes.
Welcome and enjoy.
Protect it? By taking it and putting in their own pocket?
I do see the irony of "protecting the reward pool via a $1000 post. On the other hand the guy he is flagging was taking more than that a day.
I don't think you have been here long enough to tell others how they should act.
It is a free blockchain open to those who can handle it. Decide if you like it or not and choose to understand the dynamics or move on.
The choice is yours, nobody is going to beg you to stay, and there is nothing we can do to control the Bern. Most of what he does is for the good of the blockchain. He just doesn't use nice words. Your eyes will not burn.
@mitrado I'm not the one to advocate Bernie or anybody else or their actions. I never even stated I agreed with their course of action. Try addressing those individuals and they might respond and let you know their thoughts.
I just did let you know mine. The blockchain is about liberty and there can be no liberty without freedom of speech.
bye bye
You realize this is a farmed profiles defending him . There is noway there are 1,000 faceless profiles all of sudden appearing around here. Unless he paid for all their accounts ?
thanks for you.......your information right.......
No, it doesn't work that way. It isn't easy to sign up on SteemIt. It isn't bullying it's going wtf is going on around here. If you think criticism is bullying you got a lot of waking up to do. Since you like to use terms loosely around here I think reward pool raping is robbery.
I for one came her because of haejin.
This war looks like school yard bullying.
If you dont like his stuff, ignore it.
If rewards are imbalanced thats a platform fault...
Right. These guys are hating not only on haejin but on people like me who support him and his content. People claim his analysis isn’t real and he guesses but everything i have done and gotten into has earned e what he predicted. There is no point in flagging my comments or attacking me if your beef is with haejin. @berniesanders is a bully who used his power and BOTS to silence all comments against him. And watch. He will downvote my comment with his BOTS now and try to ruin my reputation while doing it. He claims to be about preserving the platform but he is destroying it by silencing comments like mine. This was supposed to be where you can post anything. There are few rules here and I’m not spamming.or breaking any rules but i will be attacked
Precisely, Mitrado. If someone wants to get a bigger share from the pie one just needs to be better - people will follow him/her. The rest is just masked (or not that much) jealousy.
Can you come up with an example or suggestion of how steem's algorithm can be improved?
Well, i thought that has been address with hardfork 19? Vote power has been exponential before this but now it's linear. That's the fairest configuration available.. otherwise whales are not incentivised to keep their steem in steem power. that wouldnt be good to steem.
Major fundamental issues with how rewards are managed on steemit.com. Fatal flaw in the design of the system, leads to whale wars and flagging wars and ....
will ultimately be a limiting factor on the price of STEEM.
Take your investment money elsewhere.
Play around on the forums if you find content you find interesting
I've been one of the earliest followers of @haejin and while his formatting and style can definitely be improved I did enjoy some of his chart readings.
He has been consistently posting at this speed for a long time, even when he was making mere cents per post. I can see some increased posting from him due to enthusiasm (who wouldn't when suddenly you do start earning a lot) but overall I wouldn't say his posting behaviour has changed all that much.
I kind of think that there was a tipping point where he started to gain some more wealthy followers that started to auto-upvote. Once you breach $10 consistently.. well, you know everybody else is going to pile up in order to get curation earnings. It's the same reason why posting today's price of Steem and SBD every day can earn some people a lot of money.
I personally don't think @haejin is abusing the system, but rather got lucky through organic growth and the way Steem(it) is set up.
I can't say I agree with the hundreds of dollars a day earnings either to be honest, but I don't know if @haejin is to blame for this or his followers (or indeed STEEM/Steemit).
I do think posting 10x a day could easily be combined and compiled into 2-3 posts a day with more substance, though. Because indeed, when the amounts get so high that it becomes 6% of the reward pool... from an ethical and long term Steem outlook that doesn't seem like a good thing.
Anyway, just giving my opinion as a more-or-less-outsider looking in. I would sooner blame the system in this case rather than @haejin specifically. I feel actively downvoting/flagging his posts may not be an ethically sound solution in this case either. But, who am I to talk? This is the Steem wild west...
@Haejin is 100% responsible for this. When you look through his comments on his posts, he consistently has specific users ONLY post on his posts. His posts have no information in them other than just some quick pictures. (His fake accounts all have posts that are similar, just a quick picture of the graph.)
Why would users come to Steemit and make an account, and then give like 50% of their votes specifically to Haejin and Haejin only.
There was also a ton of brand new accounts that were made that were trying to support haejin and that is the only activity they had, ONLY posted on Haejin and upvoted Haejin.
There is a list of probably close to 30 that have been found for sure, and there are a lot more I am sure. It is almost as if Haejin created an ecosystem to himself and is trying to add votes and fake comments to make his post look more legitimate.
90% of his funds come from ONE user who has never voted for anyone except Haejin. Is some secret whale that existed and has gotten 1.2 Million Steem from Bittrex.
I believe that whoever this whale is, created an ecosystem of his own army of accounts to upvote his own stuff and steal from the reward pool.
There is no way someone other than Haejin created tons of accounts to support Haejin and Haejin only. All the comments are very obvious to, they sit their and praise him like hes a god, or compliment him all the time on the amazing posts. AND, he uses these fake accounts to respond to posts on his posts, to make it seem like his following is a lot bigger and more real than it actually is.
You will also see that the upvotes on these fake accounts usually have a higher reward than the other people who comment on his post.
Very mature, kiddo :-) Easier to downvote than to answer. Loving bernie's followers more each day :-)
Please see the below comment where I responded to you.
Ignorant you are.
Oh, wow. I must say this is new information to me, but if this is true then perhaps there is more to this story indeed. Sigh, oh Steem....
Account creation with upvote bots is a huge problem, that I don't know how it is possible to solve without the introduction of digital identities. Even then, there are clickfarms in China. It is for this reason that I can't believe 100% in Steem's future the way things are now.. there are too many ways to abuse the system, and the bigger Steem grows the bigger this problem will get.
Easiest way to solve this issue is an army of moderators with delegated SP to find abusers such as @haejin, flag/downvote until they correct their behaviors. The problem is where to get this delegated SP around millions. @ned or @steemit can delegate. Or, a benevolent whale do that. Or, a group of good whales collaborate to make a fund (e.g. as OP from bernie) to counteract these abusers.
With a research leg such as @paulag and in future using ML/DL/AI, particularly for finding self/proxy vote abusers, proposed fund will counteract them.
It is not on the edge of ethics since these blatant abusers can be easily identifiable. For interest, anyone can look into this tool and find "thoughtless comments" such as "Cute :D, Thanks, Haha........" earning $50 which is potentially $250...that does not look good for steem blockchain.
http://www.steemreports.com/trending-comments/
I think one step would be to work as a community against users who abuse the system. You, me and the whole community can decide for themself (by flagging) if we want to support this kind of behaviour in the future.
I don't know if the answer is self-regulation. Even though it will work for a while, I don't know if it is sustainable in the long term.
Personally, I would like to see a maximum reward per post implemented, regardless of SP. @haejin's posts aren't of great quality and probably don't deserve hundreds of dollars, but may I point out that @ned's post above has already raked in $750 as well?
I am one of those accounts that just have been made to support haejin. I know him from youtube and wanted to actively support him because thats what he deserves imho. There are many like me which are simply grateful for all his work and that's how as an individual you can support him for his amazing work.
You'll never convince them barsic. It's like trying to talk to a flat earther.
I completely agree and you can see where STEEM is heading if the devs will not intervene on these issues.
check the first post about this that berniesanders made. I did some resarch on the data i could find. Dig deeper and make your own mind about this.
This is the only bone I'll throw you and anyone else who has a legit concern about what's happening. This is a snippet from the campaign for the website under my user name:
That's in 3 days. There are no bots I'm sorry to tell you. We have upwards of 50k people viewing our site a week. It's strategy, and organic, nothing else. If you don't believe me, look up the public data on it. 10k youtube followers, 3k twitter followers, 6k steemit followers, and 50k website views a week. No bots. Even crypto-bot isn't a bot, it's just a name. Hope this helps anyone looking for the real story here.
Tell me how this proves anything? There is no proof in this picture that it is your website? Plus, how is it proof that you aren't a shill Haejin account when you are stating you run a website for Haejin?
Believe what you like. I have no obligation to reveal my information to you or anyone else. Just know that you are incorrect. I'm sorry this ever happened. We have worked months promoting and garnering support from around the web, it's not worth risking all that effort to argue about something that isn't based on any facts. And on that note, I would love to see even one single piece of real evidence that there are ANY shill accounts, rather than speculation. Good day to you.
I can't even believe I'm going to do this, but if that's really all you need to know, that it's from our site......here ya go, I'm ashamed for even feeling like anyone deserves to see anything we own, because you don't, but I KNOW there are some actual humans with logical brains reading this. This is really the only other thing I will ever feel the need to share in regards to this conversation. If you still want to think what you do, go for it.
You have chosen a very apt username.
Haejin gets over 50% of my voting power and will continue to get it. It didn't start out that way, he gradually earned that level over time as I could see more and more accurate information. Unlike most people that make predictions here and elsewhere he shares his methods, and has an extremely high accuracy rate. Some of his shorter posts need to be read in context with his tutorials and the information given out on his videos, they are far from uninformative if you are armed with that information, a picture tells a 1000 words. It is easy to make money holding cryptos these days but I for one have made a good deal more than I would have if I hadn't based some of my decisions on what @haejin has said.
I'm curious though, is he supposed to be gaming the system using an army of bots or is it one account giving 90% of his upvotes? With a number like 90% it can't really be both can it?
The ecosystem gives more up votes and comments making it look like his post is legitimate and has a lot more active followers and viewers which makes the huge amount that his post is worth look more legitimate. Basically faking legitimacy through obscurity, throwing some smoke up to hide.
OK there is some logic in that argument, soooo...has he used this elaborate scheme to fool one whale and four or five others like myself? Or do all six of us, real accounts see value in haejin's posts and use our voting power to up vote him perfectly legitimately?
If haejin owns the whale account then he doesn't need the blogs and the bot army to up vote himself. He could just create a new account every few days and upvote any random crap or self upvote comments made by the whale account. Or any number of other ways that would be far less work than actually producing the fake blog. steemcleaners etc don't have the voting power to take on a whale with the ability to allocate circa 6% of the reward pool. So I'm not buying that.
Really, even if everything @haejin says is utter crap or he just decides to post pictures of his dinner every night and gets the upvotes of 5 minnows and a whale, there is still no gaming happening.
Basically you don't agree with how some whale is allocating his or her voting power and somehow that is haejins fault. I have heard many people disagree with how berniesanders and his army of accounts allocate their voting power but they have the steem power, they can use it how they please. It goes both ways.
What is the problem again?
yes, exactly ... some have tried to tell haejins shills repeatedly that yes, the whale has a right to upvote and other whales have just as much right to downvote leaving haejin with what may be left. That isn't his fault.
What he needs to take some responsibility for is that he could be mitigating both sides of the equation by taking some of those short posts and putting them into a couple or even three posts spread out through the day
At one point the system penalized anyone who posted more than four times a day. A situation like this gives support to those who would like to return to a posting limit.
For the record, I have not suggested anywhere that others do not have a right to downvote. I have simply responded to what I see as personal attacks on a man's character.
I am in full agreement that there is a debate to be had over the allocation of rewards. Diminishing returns, caps on payout / posting etc. could all be used.
Call me old fashioned but a CAPS LOCK enabled rant attacking one individual and throwing around words like "rape" is hardly the best way to initiate any kind of adult conversation
have you checked that whale activity?
Yes, I see what appears to be a guy who was not part of the ninja mine but instead bought a f**k tonne of steem a few months back. He has no obvious connection to @haejin that I can see.
Should I be checking for something in particular?
oh my gut
I am one of those accounts that just have been made to support haejin. I know him from youtube and wanted to actively support him because thats what he deserves imho. There are many like me which are simply grateful for all his work and that's how as an individual you can support him for his amazing work.
I have been searching for long to find a trustworthy TA in cryptos, I like his didactics and he got me motivated to study TA by myself.
I think you should feel ashamed posting this kind of empty accusations.
Please don't use that link for that. Bullying falls outside of the scope of steemcleaners. If you find a plagiarized post, Identity theft, stolen photos, etc.. then you can report it but moderating of content that someone finds offensive isn't something we can do.
thank you very much, I didn't know about this option. I filled the form and will help spreading the link, keep up the work!
Will be interesting to see your reaction when Steemcleaners cleans all your shill accounts and doesn't touch Bernie.
Your words are treading that fine line between caution and intimidation.
Do not cross it.
for which reason my account should be cleaned?
I got invited to steemit under a recomendation to follow one guy, and one guy only.
Just because I don't post doesn't mean I don't exist. I'm not as active on Steemit like you are, I have a life outside of steemit.
Same here. I was actively following him on twitter and once I heard he was being personally attacked I recently created a STEEM account to help aid him. I only follow 2 people on Twitter that provide crypto advice, 1 person on STEEM, and a few on Youtube.
I will say it just one more time before I leave this shit to Devs to look into. First of, I am not sure if you are aware or not, but for MANY (including me) cryptocurrencies is quite a new thing, especially the rise of the altcoins and systems. It was only recently I discovered Haejin who provided me information about TA. I am not providing you in depth details about all my gains and time of starting in investing, but it is just how it played out.
I cannot talk for all other voters/viewers on his posts but this is how I got to know the steem community. If there were more people providing crypto recommendations, whether is was technical or fundamental on Steemit, I would definitely check it out too and upvote, but where the hell are they?? You tell me.
Wanna see how good selfless crypto advice looks like? Check @cryptovestor
Look i have been trying to stay out of this whole thing but I just checked out this account and there is no information for me in there that i can use. The reason i say this is that anyone can talk about the big coins BTC,ETH, and now LTC due to its recent growth. I am still learning the whole crypto game and so i buy maybe 1/2 of those coins because the value is so high and not geared to everyone. Day-trading has become a big part of crypto and unless a coin goes up 25%+ I will not see anything from it on a partial coin. I have used @haejin for advice on the small alts that are affordable to me and are they 100% accurate no but i have made Way more than i could have imagined putting my initial startup money in just 1 coin. I would not have a steemit account nor would my account be powered up atm if it wasn't for day-trading.
If there is an issue with the payout scale than this is something that needs to be addressed but to attack someone who is providing solid advice to those that want it is uncalled for. Is this going to make me power down and close my account... No but it will prevent me from purchasing more steem and powering that up. I have seen posts get paid just as much or even more for someone trying to just profit on themselves and not giving advice.
By your definition of a fake account, I am fake! I joined only because of @haejin after I found him on YouTube by accident, and I now follow him quite religiously along with my roommate who also joined Steemit because he wanted to be able to comment, ask questions and be part of the crypto-analysis community around Haejins Blog!
You guys are flagging completely normal behavior!
I created an account to follow @Haejin and @Haejin only. I don't care for you or whatever content around here. His posts are good an honest and interest a lot of people who didn't even know about steemit before. I follow him since the beginning and yes, he did get exited and started to post more, but that is because he grew and had more requests. And that is on his success. Stop this crusade. It's dumb. If you want the system to change, do not blame him, blame the ones responsible to make steemit.
Absolute garbage. Most of not all on his blog are here, for his blog alone!
We’re trying to learn TA and he is s great teacher.
So he got some extra transition the last few days, so what! Grow up!
He's simply driving traffic from his Youtube channel. Nothing wrong with that.
You all do a lot of research!
This is a very interesting situation indeed. Me being a crytocurrency analyst myself; I'm not a huge fan of how he does his blog, but my opinion and .80 cents will buy you a cup of coffee at McDonalds. After reading through a number of his posts, I feel that in general, they seem to lacki in the content category. That said, this is a plus for some as they like to get to the meat and potatoes of an article with no interest in reading an authors colorful insight or creative use of metaphors and analogies.
Do I have an opinion in regards to using bots etc. Not one that I can substantiate, save the fact that if he was using nefarious means to upvote himself then that conduct should not be rewarded, if he wasn't then no harm no foul.
In regards to his sugar daddy whale and him accruing 6 percent of the entirety of the reward pool.. Again, touchy subject. Has he, through his hard work earned a lot of what he has? Sure.. He has been posting consistently for quite a while and for the most part been a dedicated Steemian just trying to make it. This again would be muted in the event that it was found out he was acted in a surreptitious manner to get where he is.
Onto the whale specifically. I think continually upvoting his posts to extraordinary dollar amounts is somewhat abusive of the reward pool and short sighted irresponsible behavior by a member with that much influence; again my opinion. I would hope that those at that level would look past their noses and toward the betterment of the platform and choose to evenly disperse rewards to a variety of up and coming Steemian authors.
Lets assume that Mr. Whale made some profit by taking the advice of @haejin and has made the choice to show his gratitude by up voting his posts. This I believe is fine to a point. If I had that level of influence, had profited from his advice, I would upvote a few of his posts big time in appreciation and then back it down considerably. I did my feel good deed, having rewarded him, but did not lose site of the overall goal of promoting the long term life of the platform which consists of many users.
While it may be unfair that this whale is consistently rewarding @haejin, and acting in a way that could be detrimental to the platform and its image; life is pretty much unfair all the time. The platform could shoulder a large portion of the blame as it runs on an Anarchist principle of self governance where each user is allowed to reward as often as they wish, in any amount they wish and only to those that they favor. As that is the current system; while unfair and allows for considerably disproportionate reward distribution; it is the system. So we have to work with what we have.
In looking at his blog, I think it has gotten to a somewhat ridiculous level at this point as there are many, many, Steemians that put in much more effort and produce far superior content. That said I am not going to slight him (provided he did nothing underhanded) for the efforts he put in by posting everyday, even if I find the content to be somewhat bland.
I think or hope that it will blow over at some point and this whale will look more into promoting the overall health of the site and the many users that inhabit it.
@pawsdog
I think that you make some good points. This discussion does boil down to the platform itself. There is that saying, "Don't hate the player, hate the game". I am wondering if that applies here. I am relatively new to the platform and if something out there erodes that trust in the platform then it could cause prospective users to not what to join the platform or newer users like me to leave the platform early on before investing more time.
As a new person, I would also agree with the comment that you made about people with influence upvoting to promote new people. I think this is important for the long-term health of the community. This will help the community grow and continue to sustain itself.
I agree with your well written and articulate points. I, while not a whale here have achieved whale status in other areas of interest and have a more philanthropic view on how you should conduct yourself in regards to those looking for a big break. If you want more information on that go here and find my comments as I'm not retyping all that twice.. https://steemit.com/photography/@pawsdog/steemit-quest-for-one-million-time-required-to-build-a-usd1-000-000-00-steemit-account-day-12-results
I agree, in that it is a don't hate the player, hate the game. I also sense that
I'm just going to keep grinding a way till a whale finds me.. :) I will worry about myself and the rest will take care of itself.
Again, another voice of reason in the wilderness. Thank you. The bullying needs to stop.
I agree.. and only feel that he should face repercussions in the event that he acted in bad faith to attain his current status. This being something that I have no information on so I cannot comment on it. As I said, he put in the work and everything occurring now is the result of his initial efforts. Again providing he was forthright and honest in his efforts to get there.
Some hard forks ago a maximum of four posts per day were fully rewarded. I think that was a very reasonable rule.
I think this was the problem that the 4 post a day rule was suppose to solve, so flagging wouldn't even be necessary if that rule was still in place
Was ever that rule implemented?
Previously there was a 4 post rule where after the 4th post in a day you rewards were significantly lowered.
@pandorasbox you may be right to think that @haejin may have unlock the secret to gain more rewards by posting to a certain speed and numbers a day. And I think that that is the way the system works in STEEM/Steemit. Then if everyone of us follow the same way I don't know the impact of these in the whole system. But since this is a social media type blockchain and rewards are based on posting, commenting, upvoting and blogging so we cannot stop people from reaping their rewards. Well the only thing that we may be able
to control is that there should be some limit per day as how many you can post and how many you can upvote and commenting. By then, we can control the quality of post that people can have.
Though it defeats the goal of having a quality posts if each user is only aiming for the rewards.
Yes, I think there are many problems in the current setup for STEEM.
I'm thinking perhaps we need to limit the max rewards to a certain % so that no single person can ever get more rewards than that.
But that would simply lead to people splitting up their efforts between multiple accounts and upvoting their own stuff, etc.
It's for things like this that we need digital identities like Civic. One person, one account, one reward.
Can someone explain to me the ethical stigma surrounding downvoting? On any other site, Reddit, Youtube, etc. downvoting is never an issue. One of the biggest problems with Steemit right now is the waves of bullshit spam content you have to wade through before getting to real material.
there's a spammed wall of content that's half hearted, meanwhile i pour 4 hours into creating something and putting it together and jump through hoops to get it uploaded to d.tube only for me to be the only person who upvoted my own post even though its original work? not 1 other person upvoted my last post other than myself and my blog is being repressed because its not "quality". one account I noticed would claim to draw 'popular' mainstream anime that's clearly just downloaded from google, or 'draw' pewdiepie but it was clearly a pic changed to black and white but gets more upvotes than my original art.
Downvoting spam is perfectly fine in my eyes. Downvoting a Steemian just because he earns a lot, isn't.
If it's the system that's broke we shouldn't be attacking individuals, but rather the system
Well, the whole idea behind flagging is the ability to self regulate the economy and make sure people like haejin don't get more than they deserve. Literally as you flag it says for a reason to flag, "disagreement with payouts."
People need to stop crying about flagging. It is part of the idea of Steem. Not some crazy terrible thing.
Flagging is fine to an extent. Starting a post citing a riot to "pile on" another user is flat out bullying and shouldn't be tolerated on any platform.
I definitely agree with you that the system is broken. Of course, Steemit is going through heavy growing pains right now, and it's only exacerbated by the insane price of SBD. I'm happy for haejin and glad that he's doing very well for himself, but I understand that his frequent-posting behavior ultimately hurts all users on the platform. That kind of behavior might encourage flagging until a better solution can be found - the first reason listed to flag is disagreement over reward values.
the individuals that profit from the broken system fight to protect that flaw in the system, thus we must fight them to fight the flaws.
you described the problem pretty well.
click the flag, and check the first reason you should flag a post.
and the 4th
You have a point here. I was wondering why @haejin didn't just do a few posts per day. But his followers love him. They claim to have made tons of cash following him, so I guess someone who he is helping to make 25k in a fortnight ain't gonna complain about his winnings.
They should power up their winnings and Power Up and vote for him. Or pay him directly.
Exactly, there is loophole in the system itself that needs to be regulated but since STEEM/ Steemit is a social
media community then how can we regulate social media posts and contents which are basically what makes the system works. People can upvote whatever or whoever they want to support whether a friend or a well known person or based on upvotes. I myself can just ride on the popularity of a post by just going to trending and hot tags by just keeping reply and comments all along.
This is probably the most balanced response I've seen during this debate. I've been a steemit user since Jan/Feb. I've learned quite a bit from various traders on the platform like @quickfingersluc and @exodous but @Haejin is the one I log into steemit every day to see what he's posted. The majority of Haejin's posts are videos where he walks through the TA and gives advice. Watch one of his EW teaching videos linked at the bottom of one of his posts before you launch into a tirade about the quality of his posts.
This is the second or third time I've seen Bernie attack someone over perceived abuse of the rewards pool. I agree that whales seem to have too much weight in rewards and that the algorithm for rewards needs improvement. It's also abuse when someone like Bernie purposefully attacks and shames someone like Haejin or Michelle.gent after they've contributed to the site for a long time and have organically grown their followers.
You've been on this since January of 2017 and you haven't had time to change your profile picture ?
Read his post in bold "@ned, WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO TO ADDRESS THE VOTING ABUSE ON THIS BLOCKCHAIN?". He did not say "@ned, WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO TO ADDRESS THE Haejin ABUSE ON THIS BLOCKCHAIN?". He specifically said VOTING ABUSE.
Yes, and the title says '@haejin is raping the rewards pool', which implies some kind of ill intent. I was replying to that and trying to shed some light on that mostly.
I can't believe that Haejin's success is being attacked! He has given tons to steemit and the crypto community. Many have made massive profits and learned technical analysis due to his efforts. Incredible, really if Haejin's success cannot be celebrated then I'd say steemit is screwed! Once you guys figure out how to make really successful people appear mediocre, then we can all sign up for a commie socialistic hybrid of dog sh#t
@berniesanders does seem jealous at first - he said "nobody DESERVES" 6% of the pool, in true marxist fashion BUT- I still can't believe Steemit is so easy to game! Wasn't this first question they should have had in version 1.0 ? "What if someone builds a private bot net?" - "What if someone pays a click farm?" - "What if someone pays for clicks?"
Was Steemit's only thought that they could depend on a berniesanders to make the system fair???!!! LMFAO ;-)
I too am puzzled by the lack of developer intervention to fix this issue
add to it, what if everyone have an auto-upvote that keeps on voting what ever each person post?
I would agree with the true marxist fashion comment.
There's mention of improvements the community has suggested, but no links. Any idea what those are? Diminishing returns on enormous SP values? A percentage cap of the reward pool that any given user can receive in a day?
You're right, I didn't do much homework on this, and still haven't tbh, but after my initial comment I've learned additional things that did alter my perspective on the situation since then. Thread got too big to handle and answer everything though
No, thanks
Yesterday he was calling BTC "Bullish" when even I could see it was about to correct/crash. Says it all.
I agree that the payouts he's getting are too high. if it was only 1 post ok....but he post 3-4 times a day. Some mitigating downvotes are fair in this case.
The success of cryptos is somewhat 'given'. It's a booming industry and anyone who regularly talks about it on steemit (yes, even with little knowledge) gets a portion of the reward pool. Even those who talk about those who are talking about it. See, this post is now worth more than $700!
I am not always a fan of bernie, but this time I am supporting him. Unfortunately, I cannot participate since I have to use my voting power to contain another fire in Korean community. Upvoted!
Thank you for your support on this one.
what exactly is happening in the Korean community ?
There are growing self-voting and circle-jerking of some whales and dolphins.
@berniesanders you might also want to take a look at this user:
Another great example. @ned, how can this be solved?
Go @Berniesanders Go !! Twerk it like you mean it!!!
hahahahahaha
@berniesanders, this tool is the easiest tool to catch self/proxy voters. Some "cute" comment is earning $50 which could be $300 due to SBD's broken peg. http://www.steemreports.com/trending-comments/
Thanks :)
everything in the eco-system self corrects, no matter what, even if Nibiru hits us....no worries, just let whales n' plebs like most of the users including me, spend our steem products on this instead of reinvesting it perhaps into...steem?
Agree it will correct itself, no matter how decentralized things are... power consolidates naturally cant stop it
There is a world of a difference between Haejin and that user. That person on that screenshot is not contributing at all whilst Haejin actually contributes A LOT. Ugh.
He contributes crap posts that have nothing in them that is legitimate or original. Just a bunch of crap posts with pictures. Are you another fake account? Oh yeah, you have only ever posted on Haejin and you are very knew. Fake account by Haejin, it is over man. Stop being a PoS.
LOL. I am not a fake account, the reason I did make the account is because the least I can do for someone providing me so much info is to upvote. If it wasn't for Haejin, I would have just read his posts non-registered. If you took your time to look at my profile you would have seen from my comments what I said above, 2 weeks ago.
Also, I really hope you are just someone uninterested in TA because you'd know that TA is not meant to be original first of all, it needs to be concise and sense-making. You seem you can't capture the value he's putting out to me and other people who has made significant gains from trading crypto's.
You are far too biased about this ordeal, as your name suggests. There is no point discussing this. That all, while you state ''People Oriented, Information Seeking, Debater, Poet, the list doesn't end.'' Go fix your mindset first please.
Lol sure am Biased, everyone in the world is. It just is a matter of how biased you are. You, as a new user on Steem (Trying to be nice considering I still think you are fake) and not understanding how the platform works, should understand the platform before you try to say somebody deserves the rewards from that platform. Why don't you actively become a participant on Steem and learn how it works before blindly supporting someone when you have NOOOOOOOO idea how the Steem economy works or what he is doing to negatively affect the Steem economy.
No, you blindly follow a guy that 90% of the Steem community disagrees with how much money he makes. So who is right, your supreme overlord who has brain washed you into thinking he deserves this money? Or, the 90% of people that are working EVERY SINGLE DAY to make this platform better.
Open your eyes.
I can even go so far to arrange a skype or discord call and prove I am not him. Again, I care 100% solely on cryptocurrencies and information that helps me create wealth. Steem community itself is for me a by-matter, because I wouldn't have considered joining without Haejin (I did explore around a little e.g. Blue Rock Talk). I am really surprised how you do not understand why someone can't join to just follow one person. To me, Haejin is the to-go person on spotting opportunities in TA. Do you really think that if he'd move on to another platform, I would stay?
Now you suddenly touch upon the thing about disagreement on making money. In my very first comment in this comment section I also said, I DO understand the issue with the % division on this platform. I never said I supported the division, but you are blatantly pointing your fingers to him and his ''fake'' followers. That is just incorrect. I will just await answer of dev now, they will probably have better info on the issue than you OR me.
I have to agree with @wonderweiss.
It is not acceptable to take anybody who isn't blessed with a long track record - and make ill-founded claims that they are "another fake account" just because they speak out in support of a person that you have an issue with.
Oops. I must be another fake account also.
Some people aren't interested in the whole 'posting' thing. Steemit has multiple paths of revenue - posting 'and' curation. Are we really going to begin claiming that those who aren't posting are merely pool-rape bots?
If Steemit were truly serious about preventing any form of pool rape then self-up-votes would be disabled. But no - unfortunately its allowed.
So you are telling me someone will join Steem and only ever comment on one account? Sure... seems legitimate. I also make social media accounts and only ever follow ONE person and never look at or comment on other peoples post. Sure.....
I ONLY joined because of @haejin, and pretty much only follow and comment on his blog.
I don´t behave like you when I use Steemit, and I think that it is okay if someone is only interested in one thing... Who elected you dictator?!
Just recently I have started branching out and looking at other blogs, and now I am liking Steemit more. THIS IS NORMAL!
That is precisely what I am telling you. You can even find whales who appear to have no interest in posting. Are you going to apply your logic to them also?
My point: Before firing from the hip, ensure that you actually have good cause to do so as otherwise you'll merely be fouling up the atmosphere.
How can you say that? He has literally made TUTORIALS teaching Elliot waves and pattern recognition, and is constantly repeating himself to teach new people on new video analysis... Have you got nothing better to do with your time than to bash on someone you don't even know anything about?
Ban him
have you read what steemcleaners is about?
I'm saddened by this. So I guess, it's not really about quality anymore?
If we want to attract more users to Steemit and at the same time increase its value, then something really needs to be changed. People are smart, but often they use this to abuse. Greed comes in, and deserving people get less and less.
This one tops it all over 40 bucks for a lousy comment like ( Wow:D) what has steemit become there need to be taking actions. Thanks @irreverent-dan for your investigation. I hope the Whales and devs will do something to stop this abuse of the reward pool!!!
Perhaps a good first step is to edit Steemit's design such that people like me can no longer validly claim that it is designed to allow rape of the reward pool (self-up-voting).
Of course - the counter-argument is that such is an exercise of their investment within Steemit - but ultimately a curation of self is a contradiction.
holy shit!
You can use https://steemcleaners.org/abuse-report/ :)
Thanks a lot for the link!
i use it daily because i always find filthy scammers....
Not only him. Dozens of self upvoted comments each week by proxy damarth. About 45SBD each + some junk posts witn nothing but single photo. Also 45SBD each
https://steemit.com/@abagendo/comments
My modest opinion is that noone should have more than 2 posts in the trending section on any given day.
I see some accounts that have 4-5 posts in the trending section right now.
Those who have guaranteed whale upvotes should be mindful of not clogging up the trending page with overly frequent posts, or at least accept the mitigating downvotes that may come without too much drama.
Feel the Bern!!!!
hahahaha LOL at asking @ned to save us. this is a decentralized platform, and the witnesses seemingly font care about abusing the system...not that i am saying that is the case here, necessarily. But yeah this is blockchain, yo, there's no one to save us.
actually they created an account to prevent something exactly like this
https://steemit.com/@steemit/transfers
I'm trying to explain to some of his cohorts what steemit is about, I end up being called a communist. I stopped there.
https://steemit.com/bitcoin/@haejin/kabooooom-bitcoin-cash-bch-surges-past-my-target-of-usd3-333-to-as-high-as-usd3-684-see-how-i-made-this-forecast
@moon32walker hahaha not only a communist but a dictator too, probably if you say more you will be a racist too :P
No, I'm sure you're just a Democratic Socialist. :)
"Give me a break you commies" lol this guy
It's not 6%, that's off by a decimal place @berniesanders. (Real value is 0.6%) Not sure why steem.supply displays it as such, but if you check another service, such as steemworld.org, you will see the correct value, which is 0.6% (of course, that is still a rather large chunk! I'm a stickler for details, though :P)
Edit: I just did ran the "Coming Author Rewards" feature on Steemworld for @haejin, and it calculated it at 1% of the rewards pool. (As I stated, this is still quite large!)
Note: this comment is meant to be neutral and focus on getting the facts straight. I support each stakeholder's right to vote as they see fit. I am intrigued by this mysterious whale @ranchorelaxo that has appeared seemingly out of nowhere as well. Has anyone investigated this in detail?
Upvoting this comment for visibility and to counter the hysteria caused by the erroneous 6% figure.
I do want to also mention that I have been reading @haejin's blog since he was making only $5 a post before he went viral, and more importantly, watching his videos which is where the most substantial aspect of his added value to the Steemit/cryptocurrency community comes in. Though the posts are quite brief and could be construed to be somewhat vague (as lampooned by @netuoso) the videos are often up to 30 minutes and go into great detail on Eliot wave analysis and chart pattern recognition (something he has been practicing for over 15 years.) He has a lot of YouTube followers and they make Steemit accounts just to comment on his analysis, which is partly why he has so many followers on Steemit.
.
I am aware that some believe that technical analysis is total bunk, and not surprisingly, they are generally the ones who are not themselves trained in the art. As plenty of others have stated, part of @haejin's recent success is due to the fact that he has correctly anticipated quite a few movements in cryptocurrencies, which has caused many of his followers to become rather wealthy. Therefore, the firepower to upvote him increases more rapidly than other bloggers.
Again, I support anyone's right to upvote as well as downvote as they see fit, but I just wanted to weigh in from the perspective of someone who has benefited in the past from his tutorials, general knowledge, and more specific recommendations. I also wanted to make sure that the correct figure for the potential rewards was displayed, as it is currently inaccurate on steem.supply.
I want to also mention that I respect your approach to correcting the rewards pool distribution because I know there is zero financial incentive to do so. You and @transisto are some of the few that seem willing to counter abuse by sacrificing monetary gain and I appreciate that. I admired the transparency when you were posting on @yougotflagged as well.
My apologies for this mini-essay and the self-voting, but I want to further the discussion here. Trying to see both sides to the best of my ability. Peace.
thanks for the news
@Resteemed
im going to @resteem this also, none of my posts get seen, might as well just do this ^
nice sharing brother. visit me too :)
wow.....10 posts a day many of them hundreds of dollars a piece for a chart that you can find on web sites all over the internet.....
What a gig.
Yep, it's quite the fucking racket, yet nobody wants to do anything about it. Apparently our whales beached themselves and filled their vaginas with sand.
I wouldn't be surprised if a few whales are in on this racket these days.
@thejohalfiles did some action on some of his posts today but sadly he is the only whale
Got to love the mind pictures... :)
Its probably old school whales in on it and thats why no one is doing anything.
Feel the Bern! Rep>>>0 HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA
Fevkalde
What steem app reports on % of rewards pool? 15K SP to 6% seems incorrect
If i see this correctly he is even view boting. He got way too many views on his crappy posts and even got the nerf to say "upvotes could be higher looking at my view count".
Go get this piece of shit spamming our platform!
Just like the platform says we should down vote him if he disagree with his rewards.
Stop crying.
he is gaining followers for posting See me predict price for alt coin, I am thinking it rises, it rose, I am genius every hour?
We will see, I made Christmas and New Year predictions for BTC and Steem.
Technical analysis with triangles and all this bs is pretty common and not that hard. I personally think it is more in the realm of psychology than math and should not even be sold as "technical analysis".
If his posts didnt look like he would only put in 20 minutes of time I might agree with you, but not like this.
https://steemit.com/family/@natebelt83/merry-christmas
SO GOOOD!!!
This issue should be discussed and fixed... There should be some kind of limit
He has crazy amount of followers, maybe this is what people want though...
... i hear the situation in the middle east may clear up soon too
and steemit will be widely known as a platform of consensus and congeniality .... everyone having a common purpose and agreeing on the purpose and evolution of the site .....
Hahaha
lol
You are perfectly right, something has to be done.
I wrote that before but hope there would be more of a real discussion about my suggestions (but of course also about any other ideas to solve the problem):
I think that ...
Further suggestions very appreciated ...
Please don't speak with CAPS on @berniesanders - it hurts the eyes, I agree with you that everything should be distributed evenly or at least more to the people who want to grow the platform but this is something you get with proof of stake regardless - has anyone actually asked @haejin for his thoughts on the platform and given him a proper say? There are alot of people out there who have recently made alot of money from Cryptocurrencies and Steemit will see the effect of this regardless, its an open platform, we need to consider its worth as a global and fair platform.
This is a proof of work “fraud” from Coinbase! Make sure you use your calculator before you make any transaction on this platform. Not only the calculated fee is higher than the displayed fee, in addition to that an entirely hidden charge will be revealed on top of all charges, if you are smart enough to spot it.
Leave your comment below, I am in search of a transparent place to buy cryptos and will share my experience with you guys so you can avoid these so-called trusted websites!
I am a novice, so my voice is of little importance to the system and to combat the unfair approach and use of the system. But I'm very glad that there are people like you - a counterweight to the people about whom you wrote us. Thank you
you voice is as big as any of the community members. I am very glad you gave your opinion.
Stop this nonsense. Haejin has/is helping a lot of people out. He comes out with quality content and predictions unlike some other people. All I see here is complainers.
He can do all the technical analysis in one or two posts per day but not 5-10 post with one single technical analysis this is greed, selfish and reward pool rape. If there are 15 more people like him to make 6% of the reward pool per day then you can quit your account because this would destroy steemit so think before you talk.
He does it so that his blog is easy for his followers to reference.
The fact that he uses a system of one post = one analysis is so that we can search his blog for a specific crypto currency, e.g. "Verge", and immediately get ALL posts related to verge, this is important for us!
I actually do not agree at all with this. This concept of upvote abuse is capitalism at its finest. People have every right to take their rewards and place it elsewhere in the free market. I mean this is investment science on a fundamental basis. Props to @haejin for making the most of his opportunities.
On the one hand, this is totally concerning and should be dealt with. On the other, how could it not happen?
Yeah, this is not happend for the first time. But we need to address it, talk about it and find a way to deal with those problems.
Llevo corto tiempo, pero me inquieto esta publicación, y se que es un llamado de importancia ya que muchas personas han comentado y votado a favor de un sentir. Se espera una solución pronta para que la comunidad de steemit se mantenga estable.
The easiest solution is that @ned and @steemit should delegate 1-5M SP to few moderators to counter this kind of blatant abuses. It should be for the sake of the health of steemit. Writing 10 posts each reaping $250-$300 due to one whale (or agent) voting 10 times with $280 each time is just raping the reward pool. There are other cases of abuses like commenting "Welcome to steemit" in the "intorudceyourself" section, each comment earning $30 (due to SBD price). Here are some examples:
Another way to think is that a competitor of Steemit, bought 2M SP (e.g. @ranchorelaxo) just to kill the reputation of Steemit by abusing or showing its weakness. It is similar to 51% attack on Steemit.
Calling observe for who pressed raising his.
This doesn't have anything to do with if graph boy is legit.
steemit simply can't handle users getting rewards at this level. It would only take 15 clones of graph boy to run the reward pool dry. Want to kill steemit? Because that is how you kill steemit.
If you are here just for the money, and you dont like the money, then take your business to one of the other sites where you can get rewards of any magnitude for the quality of content you are producing.
That doesn't even make sense. I'm making an argument that if you run the reward pool dry you will almost certainly kill steemit and you are telling me if I'm here just for the money to leave.
Motherfucker if I was just here for the money I would have done what chart boy did long ago. Don't think I couldn't of, it's not even an original idea. Beyond meeting my personal needs I'm not motivated by money at all.
Steemit is Proof Of Stake system. When you have POS, that means those with the most money call the shots. If you don't like POS, then go back to real life which works according to the principle of ....... oh, that's right, real life is Proof Of Stake as well.
If enough people with enough Stake are upvoting his content, who are you to dictate that that result can no longer be allowed?
Answer - without enough Stake, you are just a minnow. So you take steemit.com as it is, or you leave. That was my point.
Just seems like hes pissed that someone is making more money than you...
I don’t u derstand where all of these pitchforks are coming from. I have been following various analysts for the last year or so and I have prettt much stopped following all of them except for haejin because his advice is so much more accurate, frequent and helpful. Haejin has spent an insane amount of time creating this content, and he has given back to the steemit community more than any other user I know of. What have you done for the community other than create hateful posts?
For most people technical analysis is extremely difficult, and so they can never see the quality, they don´t understand that you and I can see a simple chart image that Haejin has made, and instantly understand all that he is communicating through that chart.
But his followers understand and that is what is most important
Not going to lie you seem to be making out well as well from this. But yes he is getting a lot. But he also does good work and deserves some of the reward
I'm not making out well from this, I've spent far more in bot votes to get visibility than I will get in return. So, I'm actually wasting money here on this issue more than just flagging the posts.
Sir. You are gaining from every comment you make. Every post is 10x more than your usual posts. Maybe you have spent a lot of money. But you will make it back with more posts like this.
You actually have not paid a lot of bots. I call BS on you. You are here profiting from this as well.
The Steemit community is awsome!! We have an awesome crypto idea we are launching come and check it out!!
Very good points and thank you for bringing it up. Maybe if enough people spread attention to the issue, then the rest of the community will respond. Anyways, while I'm not big by any means I support your main point. Keep fighting the good fight!
Thats not a good fight, just a jelous user who can't make a buck on steemit and want others to lose what they earn. at least take a look of the quality content on @haejin ' s posts, and look the shittie stolen content on sanders
Ok thanks for the heads-up... I understand his points about using bots, but yes if he is earning his money without cheating then I agree with you about that good content should be rewarded. Frankly, I jumped to a conclusion without all the facts. I'll keep my eyes open and my mouth shut until I have more experience here :) ... Again thanks
WTF are you on about?
His TA is top notch and he has made many millionaires.
People can vote what ever they want vote up. Instead of complaining about otheres making money by providing value, how about you start doing that?
Nice post 👍 Thanks for sharing and and very useful information and good job. Congratulations✌ @berniesanders
The newer people of steemit needs these rewards to grow!
sir this post is awesome ...
@berniesanders The case with Haejin is damn unfair, but why are you angry? You earn with a schort writing over 800. You are one of the kings;) I put in an article more than 3 hours and just got 30 cents. So thats how life and steemit works. What are your ideas to make it better? Obviously you have some power and can do something. Does flagging really work? You have a really bad reputation but it doesnt matter. So you are kind invincible. But are you the only on? Much success if you want to make steemit better!
That's really sad. Some of these whales ought to take a stand. People like me surely could do a lot more even with a one dollar more in upvote:)
Maybe a group of whales could regularly look into such issues or reported users.
I've only been here about a month, so I'm still new to this whole thing, but based on what @bernie is saying, I hope the dev's look into things more, judge the value of what content is being provided for how it's being priced and the bot issues and if there is any manipulation going on.
This sanders guy has nothing to add to this community, all his post are trash, has no value, look at haejin's blog, only good stuff. Remember that Steemit is a meritocracy not comunism.
Hmmm I see your point, but what would you say if @haejin would do something good with the money? Creating a charity or beneficial project? Something which would help other people in a fundamental way?....
ah I bet he doesn't. Unfortunately.
However, if he would I wouldn't see a problem. Whatever.
Have happy holidays!
this does not solve any of steems abuse problems of its reward pool . No one is questioning about if @haejin´s content is valuable or not. He is cooperating with a very big whale and is earning much more then almost anyone in this platform (think about it 6% of all the reward pool). There are so many artist/users who deserve much more then they get.
Are you guys realising that @haejin(just because he has a whale behind him) is removing 6% out of the reward pool which could go to all other users.
In my view, @haejin is abusing the reward pool and I am supporting @berniesanders.
Ok I see your point... that's actually not good. Agreed.
we all need to work together here because we are all steemians. We don`t have a central point who is setting the rules(like reddit for example), which means we need to set the rules together as a community.
I just looked at your Blog and I think you deserve much more of the reward pool.
Cool das du bei Steem dabei bist :)
All need to work together, for the common good, as a single uniform group of "good Steemians". You sounds like Karl Marx, without the Marx and with Steem as the replacement
He's legit. And honest so I'm not worried
What's amusing to me is that at the time of this comment, this post is worth +$1k SBD, or +$13k USD. How's that for irony.